Trinity

[Yitzchak]

I am well aware that the administrator and the moderators do not present the trinity, had been expressing this t any of you it would have been in a PM. This is a forum and some people who read it are still carrying the concept in their hippocket, so in no uncertain terms I have expressed teaching such a dogma is to look forward to severe penalties.

This is fine, however, two moderators took your wording to be an admonishment to those who had already posted. So, perhaps you can use different wording in the future to avoid needless controversy.

So if only those who have been revealed that God and Yeshua are echad are accepted here just say so, because I do not wish to be where I am unwanted.

Everyone is accepted here Pioneer, and you are valued for your input here. However, all of us are required to abide by the forum rules. This forum was set up as a safe place for those seeking knowledge on observant Messianic Judaism.

Keep in mind that as you noted, there might be somebody here who has the trinity concept in their hip pocket due to false teaching that many of us have, or had walked around with for years. It is more important for us to lovingly guide them through the scriptures, and show them the truth regarding this false concept, rather than bringing condemnation.

I just don't see how you and I discussing our beliefs has now turned into you not being welcome here. Perhaps it is time to table this discussion, seek HaShem in prayer, and move on to other discussions.

Shalom and may you have an easy fast,

Yitzchak

[Nachshon]

Pioneer, time for a paradigm shift. If Yeshua was not one with Abba, then He could not have been Mashiach.
That is my belief.

Shalom~
Dov

[Pioneer]

nachshon said:

Pioneer, time for a paradigm shift. If Yeshua was not one with Abba, then He could not have been Mashiach.
That is my belief.

Shalom~
Dov

Nacshon, I am sorry, but I have searched diligently for a scripture wherein the annointed would be God and I have to this day not found it, here is the closest I have found; Isa 9:6 For to us a child is born, to us a son is given; and the government will be upon his shoulder, and his name will be called "Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace."
Do I think this scripture is fortelling the birth of Yeshua?
Yes! Does it say he will be any one of those things? No!
So until, the comfortor, God or Yeshua reveal this to me, I would be remiss to accept the word of a man.
Mt 8:29 And behold, they cried out, "What have you to do with us, O Son of God? Have you come here to torment us before the time?"
Mt 14:33 And those in the boat worshiped him, saying, "Truly you are the Son of God."
Mt 27:54 When the centurion and those who were with him, keeping watch over Jesus, saw the earthquake and what took place, they were filled with awe, and said, "Truly this was the Son of God!"
Mr 1:1 ¶ The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God.
Lu 1:35 And the angel said to her, "The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be called holy, the Son of God.
Joh 1:34 And I have seen and have borne witness that this is the Son of God."
Joh 1:49 Nathanael answered him, "Rabbi, you are the Son of God! You are the King of Israel!"
Joh 10:36 do you say of him whom the Father consecrated and sent into the world, ‘You are blaspheming,’ because I said, ‘I am the Son of God’?
Joh 11:4 But when Jesus heard it he said, "This illness is not unto death; it is for the glory of God, so that the Son of God may be glorified by means of it."
Joh 11:27 She said to him, "Yes, Lord; I believe that you are the Christ, the Son of God, he who is coming into the world."
Joh 20:31 but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in his name
Re 2:18 ¶ "And to the angel of the church in Thyatira write: ‘The words of the Son of God, who has eyes like a flame of fire, and whose feet are like burnished bronze.

De 17:6 "Whoever is deserving of death shall be put to death on the testimony of two or three witnesses; he shall not be put to death on the testimony of one witness.

By the testimony of a myirad of witnesses it is established Yeshua is the "Son of God". Even the one named Yeshua; "Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace." Joh 10:36 do you say of him whom the Father consecrated and sent into the world, ‘You are blaspheming,’ because I said, ‘I am the Son of God’?
If it is good enough for both Johns, it is fine with me!

The controversey will end at the coming of the Lord!
Shalom

[Pioneer]

I just don't see how you and I discussing our beliefs has now turned into you not being welcome here. Perhaps it is time to table this discussion, seek HaShem in prayer, and move on to other discussions.

Shalom and may you have an easy fast,

Yitzchak

Todah Rabah.
May your fast also be easy.
Shalom

[Nachshon]

Zecheriah 12:10, "w'habiytuw 'elay eth asher-daqaruw." that is, "And they will look upon me whom they have pierced" "And I looked, and there was none to help, and I beheld in astonishment, and there was none to uphold; therefore Mine own arm brought salvation unto Me, and My fury, it upheld Me." Is. 63:5 (JPS)

Shalom,
David

[Pioneer]

nachshon said:

Zecheriah 12:10, "w'habiytuw 'elay eth asher-daqaruw." that is, "And they will look upon me whom they have pierced" "And I looked, and there was none to help, and I beheld in astonishment, and there was none to uphold; therefore Mine own arm brought salvation unto Me, and My fury, it upheld Me." Is. 63:5 (JPS)

Shalom,
David

I pass! I have made my understanding clear.
I like Gershom Solomon, will ask Yeshua (GS)"Your first time in Jerusalem?" (Pioneer) "So, you are both Father and son?"
No! All mystery will be revealed at his coming. Right now it is important that we stop "grasping for the wind."
2Ti 2:14 ¶ Remind them of these things, charging them before the Lord not to strive about words to no profit, to the ruin of the hearers.
For it is, "written!"

Shalom

Shalom

[Nachshon]

Amein. When Yeshua comes, He will tell us.

Shalom,
David

[Glenda]

Yeshua said we must accept the Kingdom as a child. Yeshua spoke simple Truth directly from God. Our understanding should have nothing to do with human education or perspective. Yeshua stated that God is a Spirit. This is the God of Yeshua ... your God and my God. If God were something different then Yeshua would have said so. Abraham and Isaac and Jacob did not have different Gods to each other and they believed in the One God.
God speaks Truth and God says He is not a man. Yeshua persistently called himself a man and when he rose from death he ensured the apostles confirmed he was flesh and bone and NOT a spirit.
The good news that he brought was that we can repent and obey God so the Spirit of God can enter us so we too can become children of God. If Yeshua was not a man then we have no hope because we would have no proof that the Spirit of God could live in humans to enable us to become children of God. The Kingdom has many houses for God's Spirit ... in my Father's house are many mansions, if it were not so I would have told you.
Yeshua hoped we would be 'one' as he and the Father are 'one' ... ie have unity.
It is easier to think of Spirit like air ... necessary for life but invisible and can joyfully enter us. This doesn't make the person who contains air also air ... just a healthy carrier of air. This is an uneducated simple childish perspective.
I believe what scripture clearly states and have no desire to wonder about what it does not state. That is in the 'too-hard' basket and I trust God with showing us what we need to know clearly.
I for one am grasping for the wind:
JN 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

[Nachshon]

Be afraid. Be very afraid. The David-meister is back! <G>
Father is a Spirit, true. But is He only a Spirit? B'reshit 2:7.
God is not a man, true. But can a man be God? Yukhanan 1:1-14.

Shalom,
David

[R' Y'hoshua Moshe]

Keep in mind that as you noted, there might be somebody here who has the trinity concept in their hip pocket due to false teaching that many of us have, or had walked around with for years. It is more important for us to lovingly guide them through the scriptures, and show them the truth regarding this false concept, rather than bringing condemnation.

I just don't see how you and I discussing our beliefs has now turned into you not being welcome here. Perhaps it is time to table this discussion, seek HaShem in prayer, and move on to other discussions.

Done.