Kashrut (Kosher laws)

[steve_613++]

Hello chumash614 and Shalom.
Thanks for your reply. I'm not sure which post you're replying to, so here's my response to yours.

I believe that some foods are clean while others are not.

Agreed.

If it was good for you, I think G-d would allow it to be eaten.

Agreed.

Did you know that pigs are inbreeding cannibals? That is disgusting and fatally unhealthy.

Agreed. And I know lots of other repulsive facts about pigs; but it's not a problem for me---I don't eat pork. My G-d tells me pigs are not food. So I thankfully obey His commandment not to eat them.

On the subject of dairy and meat: I do not mix at all. I not only find it repulsive, but I feel that it does provide a fence around .

In principle, I'm not against the Rabbinical practice of putting fences around .

How do we know that the cheese for your burger was not from the burger's mother?

Well, burgers are made from cow, not sheep or goat. As far as I'm aware, the miztvah refers to "kid" not calf. It does not say don't boil the young of any food animal in its mother's milk. Not that I ever intend to do such a thing, you understand, but the mitzvah does not refer to cow/beef. Furthermore, the mitzvah is specific in the wording of this prohibition in that it spells out "boiling/seething" rather than any other way of preparing; it specifies "kid" and rather than saying simply "milk" we are prevented from using "its mother's" milk. Okay, I'll admit this could mean the milk from the same species, but it seems to actually stipulate it's own mother as opposed to, say, it's sibling.

I follow the Rabbis, but I also understand your points.

I follow Yeshua, who disagreed more than once with the Rabbi equivalents of his day about their traditions. "Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men."

I figure it is an easy law to practice.

It may be easy, but whose "law" is it? Again, I think we can learn much from Rabbinical traditions, but they must come second place to , and they must not conflict with it. Not that this one (meat/dairy) does, it extends it, but massively!

" Do you want cheese on your hamburger? - No" Simple.

Agreed.

Now don't get me wrong, I want to hear anyone's view. In fact, I once read that one of the reasons orthodox Jews accept the Oral as inspired is because it explains things that would otherwise be inexplicable were we to rely only on the written . One example mentioned this mitzvah and the author said that the Hebrew phraseology used is unusual but the Oral explains why. If anyone knows more about this please share it. At the moment I do not accept Oral as binding or as inspired, but this does not mean that I do not consider it to be of value.

Shalom,
Steve.

[The 614th Mitzvot]

I accept Oral , perhaps not completely divinely inspired, but rather as good advice. Most of Oral actually points to Yohshuah HaMoshiach.
I do not want to get to much into the discussion of Talmud, however, I will say that I observe Talmud, but never more than Tanch or B'Rit Chadashah.

[R' Y'hoshua Moshe]

I accept Oral , perhaps not completely divinely inspired, but rather as good advice.

I would agree

I do not want to get to much into the discussion of Talmud, however, I will say that I observe Talmud, but never more than Tanch or B'Rit Chadashah.

I think you have the right perspective.

Shalom achi,

Reuel

[IronWill]

The said:

I believe in keeping meat and dairy completely seperate. How do you know if that milk that the cheese is made out of is not the milk of your hamburger's mother? I won't mix the two on my stove or in my refrigerator.

Meat and Dairy cattle are raised seperately. Dairy Cattle come from certain breeds, and Meat cattle come from other breeds. The chances that you are going to get the cheese from the calf's mother is extremely remote, unless you're buying from a local farmer.

[R' Y'hoshua Moshe]

Meat and Dairy cattle are raised seperately. Dairy Cattle come from certain breeds, and Meat cattle come from other breeds. The chances that you are going to get the cheese from the calf's mother is extremely remote, unless you're buying from a local farmer.

Shalom IronWill,

Thank you for sharing this. Do you have some experience in this area?

[Rick]

"I believe was *re-instituted* via Moshe at Sinai with a set-apart priesthood beginning only then. The patriarchs somehow understood , possibly by direct revelation from G-d in a time when every man was his own priest. Otherwise, how did Cain and Abel know to sacrifice? Who taught them? Who taught Abraham to tithe to Melchizedek? How did Noah know the difference between clean and unclean animals. Far more clean animals were taken into the ark --- I believe they were for sacrificial purposes and food."

The first 2157yrs of history were covered by three men whose lives overlap, (Adam, Methuselah, Shem). How much do you think you could learn in 950yrs ?
According to the Genealogy and long life spans pre flood,(Gen 5:1), it is possible that Noah could have been taught by Enos.(Gen 7:6). Noah Had 6 living ancestors that could have known Adam personally. Prior to the flood the oral tradition was most likely very rich and could be confirmed or corrected by many living contemporaries all the way back to Adam who "Walked and talked with G-d" (Gen 2:19, Gen 2:20, Gen 3:9-13). All 10 of Abraham's post flood ancestors, including Noah, were alive for his early life.

"How did Noah know the difference between clean and unclean animals."

Noah also "walked with G-d",(Gen 6:9). Gen 6:21, Gen 7:2-3,

"I believe they were for sacrificial purposes and food."

Scripture says as much: Gen 8:20, Gen 9:3-4.


Just a thought to throw out there
for consideration.

[Rick]

I work for a small beef feed yard,(Wiechman Feedyard LP), as feed manager. We raise beef, (for TYSON, and National Beef), and dairy cattle, (for West Plains Dairy, and Plymel Dairy). Dairy cattle are bred exclusively for dairy production, their use as food is secondary. When a Dairy cow has outlived it's time of peak milk production they are culled from the herd and sold. Most go to packers that turn them into hamburger, various beef byproducts, pet food, lunch meats, hotdogs, etc. Since the meat would not be of the quality to be sold as individual cuts.
Beef cattle on the other hand are bred and raised just as food. Beef cattle are never used for dairy.
Beef cattle are rarely older than 30 months at the time of slaughter.
Dairy cattle can be as old as 4-5 yrs when they've reached the end of their productive life.

[IronWill]

Reuel said:

Shalom IronWill,

Thank you for sharing this. Do you have some experience in this area?

I've worked on a farm some, and have hung out with many farmers. I'm also a meatcutter, and I read various magazines and articles on the raising of cattle and farming.

[Chizuk Emunah]

Shalom Ironwill. Any interest in becoming a shochet? There definitely aren't enough of them out there.

[IronWill]

NotzriY'hudi said:

Shalom Ironwill. Any interest in becoming a shochet? There definitely aren't enough of them out there.

After looking that up and figuring out what that is, it sounds interesting. I haven't quite figured out what I want to do with my life yet, although I do know that I want to serve God in full or part time service. There's probably some intense schooling involved in become a shochet and/or a kosher butcher. I'm not very much involved in meatcutting presently, other than cutting chicken, cleaning fish, and working with deli meats, and occasionally cutting the chuck for ground beef.