Jesus, Yeshua, Yohshua

[Vaneide]

Shalom everyone,

Which name is correct to say: Jesus, Yeshua or Yohshua? ;D

Vaneide

[Chizuk Emunah]

Shalom vaneide,

Well, let's go ahead and take a look at these different names and the background behind them:

1. We'll start with Jesus:
- This name conjures up all kinds of images, both positive and negative.
- Until recently, the man associated with this name was pictured as blond-haired, and blue-eyed.
- Also, even to this day, many contend that he spoke Greek, and not his native Aramaic.

2. Yeshua or Yeshua
- This is a shortened form of the hebrew name of the Messiah.
- This is most likely the name he was known by his family, friends, and talmidim.

3. Y'hoshua ben-Yosef
- This is the Messiah's full hebrew name. It translates as Joshua, son of Joseph.
- This is also significant because the Messiah that is regarded as the "suffering servant," is called Moshiach ben-Yosef.

So, you might ask, how did we get from Y'hoshua ben-Yosef to "Jesus"?

The main translation was lost when translating the name "Yeshua" from Hebrew and into Greek. The problem there was that the letter "y" was not part of the Greek alphabet, and the "sh" sound was not included either. So you ended up with "ee-ay-soo-ah." Also add to the fact that traditionally, masculine Greek names never ended in a vowel sound. Those that did were automatically given the letter Sigma or "s" as a suffix. Another problem is that the two vowel sounds before the "s" do not flow and are virtually never seen in Greek. So the last vowel sound was dropped, as it was in other names, and we were left with "ee-ay-soos". Aside from the added tradition of giving the name a masculine sound, this is the closest a Greek speaking person could come to transliterating the name Yeshua. As you can see by this point, the name Yeshua has lost all of it's meaning and most of its sound. The last vestige of it's sound was found in the "oo" (as in "soon") sound. Yeshua was known as "ee-ay-soos" to the Greek speaking world for nearly 400 years.

Around 400 A.D. the Latin language became the predominate language of Christianity and the Greek versions of the New Testament were translated to Latin. The Latin Bible, or Vulgate as it is called, also transliterated what was left of Yeshua's Greek name by bringing across the same sound of "ee-ay-soos". This was easy because all of the Greek sounds in this name are also made in Latin. The letters of the Latin alphabet are different from that of Greek but virtually identical to English. The new transliteration of the Greek name "ee-ay-soos" became written as "Iesus" and was identical in pronunciation to the Greek name. This Latin spelling and on-going pronunciation dominated the Christian world for nearly 1,000 years.

Before the 12th century, the letter ( J ) did not exist in the Old English language. The sound the letter ( J ) makes has never existed in the Hebrew, Aramaic, Greek, or Latin languages. This fact is why no one in Yeshua's day could have accurately pronounced the English name Jesus even if they tried to. Sometime during the early 12th century ( J ) began showing up in some obscure dialects of the Middle English language. Over the course of the next 500 years, infatuation with the new sound caused letters like ( I ) and (Y) in the English language to be replaced by a ( J ). This was especially true of male names that began with ( I ) or (Y) because the hard sound was again considered more masculine.

Then in 1526 William Tyndale translated the New Testament to the English language from the Latin Vulgate along with the additional help of some ancient Greek manuscripts. Tyndale wanted the Bible translated into the language of the common people and many copies of his translation were printed with the help of the printing press. Tyndale was the first to use the letter ( J ) in the spelling of the name "Jesus."


That's how we went from Yeshua to "Jesus." Personally, I prefer to use the name Yeshua or Y'hoshua ben-Yosef

[Vaneide]

Shalom Notzary,

Thank you for the good and clear explanation. Now, I have a question: If I pronounce the name Jesus, am I pronouncing a pagan name? Of curse, I prefer to pronounce Yeshua in my prays. But, my husband is a christian and also his family and churchu, and I am a part of that. So, I have to say Jesus or pronounce Jesus, because if I pronounce Yeshua or Yohshua they'll not understand what I am sayng.

Vaneide.

[R' Y'hoshua Moshe]

Thank you Notzari Y'hudi, that was very thorough.

Vaneide,

I wouldn't necessarily say that it is a pagan name. It is not the actual name of Messiah…But, a name is a name. We could say that the language of origin was that of a pagan nation, but this does not mean that every name from that nation is pagan. I know that many make connections with the pagan god "Zeus" when talking about the name of "Jesus", but again, a name is a name. I could name my son Zeus (not that I would want to), but because he would have the name Zeus would not make him pagan...it is just a name. But, my question is, why would we want to refer to Messiah with a name that is not His? "Yeshua" means salvation, although "Jesus" does not mean salvation. I usually say Yeshua, but immediately qualify it with the name of "Jesus" so people know whom I am referring to. It is interesting to also note that the name found on the burial box of Yeshua’s brother Yaakov (James) was spelled “Yod”, “Shin”, “vav”, “ayin” which results in the English spelling of “Yeshua”.

Just my two cents...

[The 614th Mitzvot]

I disagree, a name is so important on how a person livess their life. Aname effects how people recieve them and how they are able to move through life. A rose called 'smelly toilet flower' would smell as sweet, but who would smell it? So a name effects how a person lives so it is very important that the savior be named savior. For this reason the angel came down to give him a name: Yimmanuel. I use the name Yohshuah HaMoshiach or Yahushuah HaMoshiach. This is because the spelling "Yud, He, vav, shin, Vav, He" has the divine ineffable name spelled out in it. The first two letters and the last two spell out the divine name, announcing Yohshuah HaMoshiach as the first and last, the middle vav is because the first vav in is connecting heaven and earth and it is the 22nd letter alluding that it connects all the letters, everything; vav is also at the beginning of every vertical line in a sefer . The shin is the most powerful letter, three yuds in one! A letter that symbolizes HaShem's power: Sh-ddai.

[R' Y'hoshua Moshe]

I disagree, a name is so important on how a person livess their life. Aname effects how people recieve them and how they are able to move through life. A rose called 'smelly toilet flower' would smell as sweet, but who would smell it? So a name effects how a person lives so it is very important that the savior be named savior.

I agree, the meaning of a name is very important. All I was saying is that aside from Messiah's true name, the name "Jesus" is not an evil name as we think of the term pagan. Nonetheless, it is not Messiah's name.

Shalom,

Reuel

[Chizuk Emunah]

I agree, the meaning of a name is very important. All I was saying is that aside from Messiah's true name, the name "Jesus" is not an evil name as we think of the term pagan. Nonetheless, it is not Messiah's name.

Agreed on all points...

[Vaneide]

Thank you you all. I think I am happy with all yours answers,

Vaneide.

[Chizuk Emunah]

You're welcome. Hopefully that enabled you to come away with a better understanding.

[Mercedes]

Shalom Vaneide,
I have written an article on this name and have copied it without the images but have attached the link:[ftp]http://www.yeshuaekklesia.com/Joshua.html[/ftp]
Jesus is pagan in all aspects. I would use the word Christ (Christon Greek) at home or among other Christians rather than invoke a druid deity's title.


According to the Catholic Encyclopedia the "Sacred Monogram IHS," is a symbol of uncertain origin and cannot be truly defined. But right before your very eyes is the monogram of Joshua recorded some 300 years B.C.
But if they told you it was Joshua's monogram your next question would most likely be,"why don't we call him Joshua?" The name Jesus and Church are of a God and Goddess that predate Christ.
All religious leaders of just about every faith will tell you that the names Hesu, Jesu, Jesus, Jezus are all the many forms of Old, Middle and Late English, reflecting English dialects changing over the Years. But what is fascinating is that the book of Joshua in all the years of translations never changes. Never is Joshua translated as Jesus or any other of the many variations.

Picture right A, is a copy of Mathew in the Greek interlinear Bible and as you can see the Apostles spelled Joshua exactlty as the Greek Septuagint recorded it in 300B.C.

Picture right, is a copy of the Gutenberg Bible 1454,
It is the prologue to the "Librum Josue"(last two words) the" Book of Joshua". In the New Testament he mysteriously becomes Hesus.
Now let's take a look at the Druid god Hesus, as Markus Lucan A.D.39-A.D.65 a roman poet writting at the same time as the apostle John was says:

sunsite.berkeley.edu/OMACL/Pharsalia/book1.html
First of the long-haired nations, on whose necks
Once flowed the auburn locks in pride supreme;
And those who pacify with blood accursed
Savage Teutates, Hesus' horrid shrines,
500 And Taranis' altars cruel as were those
Loved by Diana (18), goddess of the north;
All these now rest in peace. And you, ye Bards,
Whose martial lays send down to distant times
The fame of valorous deeds in battle done,
Pour forth in safety more abundant song.
While you, ye Druids (19), when the war was done,
To mysteries strange and hateful rites returned:
To you alone 'tis given the gods and stars
To know or not to know; secluded groves
510 Your dwelling-place, and forests far remote.

The apostles clearly had ample opportunity to use this name during their time in their writtings. Finally, Acts 7:45, "0ur fathers having inherited with Joshua, in the taking of possession of the nations.." The intelinear records the apostles writting Joshua exactly as picture A above shows. Only translators were forced to correctly write the name "Joshua," since the scripture clearly was in reference to the Old Testament leader. All of Latin America still calls him Hesus to this day. So why do we say his name with a "J"? Most will remember learning in grade School that the "J" was invented and added to the Roman Alphabet by the romans.
For example we all say "Jerusalem" in the Roman venacular while it is spelled in Greek and Latin as (strongs #2419) "Hierousalem."
Picture above, Pillar of Esus (celtic var) or Hesus (latin var) dedicated to Jupiter A.D 14
at the Cathedral of Notre Dame.

The Roman Emperor Justinian recorded and enacted many laws regarding Christians in 200 A.D. He records the name of this Druid deity "Hesu" as our "Christo" or Messiah. With just a slight change of the written pen a pagan god replaces our "Salvation," which the name Joshua means, "Gods Salvation."

"Nostra quoque maiestas semper investigando et perscrutando ea quae ab his componebantur, quidquid dubium et incertum inveniebatur, hoc numine caelesti erecta emendabat et in competentem formam redigebat. Omnia igitur confecta sunt domino et deo nostro i Hesu Christo possibilitatem tam nobis quam nostris in hoc satellitibus praestante *

Blessings in Yeshua,
Mercedes

[Todah Yeshua]

Here's my two cents. My name is chuck but in Mexico I'm called Carlos, but I still know my name when it's being called. Even the more does Yeshua know who I'm talking to when I say Jesus, because he not only hears my voice but he also knows my heart. I didn't know the name Yeshua when I cried out to Him, but He heard my cry, and He knew my heart. When the father drew me to my knees the name I called out was Jesus, and He came and has not left me for even a day. In Acts 2:6 didn't G-d cause every man to hear his brothers in their own language? Wouldn't you think that the G-d that did this could also hear every man in his own language? I'm thankful that I know Him today, and I believe that if I called out to him as the Way, the Truth, or the Life he would know who I was talking to because He lives in me, and I in Him.

Your brother in Yeshua (Jesus),
Chuck

[Mercedes]

Shalom Carlos,

We all come out of this world through some door of the world's doctrine. I came from the Catholic Sabbath of Sunday, I was taught it was the sabbath and did not know till I was 18 that there was a little switch, a slight change. But the Sabbaths I kept in love and innocence I am not ashamed of. That is where my relationship began with Yeshua. But this thread is not about the doors we came through rather the clarity of the narrow path at my feet.

Shalom Mercedes

[Todah Yeshua]

The thread started out with this question.

Which name is correct to say: Jesus, Yeshua or Yohshua?

All I'm saying is that when I pray to Jesus He hears me even though that is not his given name because He knows my heart and my mind. So does that make one of the names above correct and not the other? Does He hear one of those names better than the other?

If you pray to Him using the name Yeshua then I believe he hears you, and if the next guy prays to Him using the name Jesus I believe he still hears him, so how is one correct and the other not?

You would think that if one wasn't correct then He wouldn't hear it, but He does.

But this thread is not about the doors we came through rather the clarity of the narrow path at my feet.

I agree that it's about the clarity of the narrow path at our feet, but I believe that the narrow path is obedience to His commands, and not the pronunciation of names.

If that was the case then everyone that didn't speak hebrew would be lost. There are poeple all over the world that don't know Him by His hebrew name, but still are obedient to His commands.

Obedience is greater than pronunciation.

When I say Jesus I'm talking to the one that came to restore what was lost, and not any pagan anything.

I know a lot of people named James, but when I read the book of James I'm not reading about those other people that I know, I'm reading about the brother of Jesus. And when I say Jesus i'm not talking to whoever the pagans were talking to, I'm talking to the one who died on the cross for my sins.

Shalom, Chuck

[R' Y'hoshua Moshe]

Shalom chaverim,

I think that some people simply don't know the name "Yeshua" and the Father hears their prayers with the right heart. But, outside of the discussion of hearing one's prayers, a name holds great importance and once someone's ignorance is removed there is accountability. Proper names should not be translated...they should be transliterated which means that they should be translated to sound exactly like they do in the original. Obviously, this was not done with the name "Jesus".

Again, a name holds great importance or do we think that G'd named His Son in vain? Of course not. If G'd gives someone a name, whom are we to change it. If the name and the meaning of the name has great importance to G'd, whom are we to change that name, or meaning thereof? "Yeshua" means salvation, "Jesus" does not. Are we so confident in ourselves to change the very name of Messiah...the One that G'd used to create all things? G'd gave Ya'akov (Jacob) the name Yisrael (Israel), but would it be acceptable for us to refer to Yisrael as "Bob" as long as our heart is right? You see, when we have knowledge of the truth and do not act on it...it reveals our heart. Does not one whom goes before a King address that king by his proper name? Is Yeshua any different? Yes, a name holds great importance, especially when it deals with the King of The Universe.

Furthermore, when the scripture says not to take away or to add to it, did it not include the name of Messiah? The Adversary has always tried to blot out the name of Messiah from under heaven and I believe that this is just one more tactic to accomplish his goal.

My reply is not directed at anyone here on the forums as it is directed at the concept of changing the name of Messiah.

Berachot b'shem Yeshua HaMashiach
(Blessings in the name of Yeshua The Messiah),

Reuel

[Todah Yeshua]

So, those that take the gospel to another land do it in vain unless they teach them hebrew first? They can't speak to them in their own language?

I don't believe that the Messiah is ment to be a stumbling block for those who seek him, or that He should be put out of reach of those who seek Him.

When I say Jesus it means Messiah to me, it means Salvation to me because the name Jesus means Yeshua to me. See, I don't know who the pagans were talking to when they used that name, but if it wasn't the Son of G-d who died on the cross for our sins then we are not talking to the same Jesus. The name Jesus means Yeshua to me, and Yeshua means Salvation.

Peace and blessings to all, Chuck