Matthew 18:21-35

[Elizabeth]

Mathew 18:21-23

Then Peter came to Him and said, "L-rd, how often shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? Up to seven times."
Yeshua said to him, "I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven.  Therefore the kingdom of heaven is like a certain king who wanted to settle accounts with his servants.


Based on the wording in this passage, do people agree that it is accurate to say that this parable only apples to believers and fellow believers?


I ask this because there are people who simply hate G-d and sin to hurt Him and destroy the work He is giving us to do.  They are trying to destroy our lives.  This sounds stupid, but I am dealing with what to do with anger about sin and wickedness.  What is our place as G-d is the judge and we are only His servants.   Meanwhile, I have one life to live on this earth and I am sick of wicked people wasting my time with their confusion and exploitation. I know G-d doesn't need me to accomplish anything, but I want to participate in His will and I don't want to be held any more accountable for the time I waste or what I didn't do than I already am. I want to limit the role of sin in my life just like every believer does.


We know there are people who are working on behalf of the adversary to stop us. Some of them, including us at one time or another, have done so likely in ignorance. But then there are those who do it knowingly.  How do we handle the emotions that come up with them.  I trust G-d, I love Who He is, I am grateful for His patience, and mercy.  I know He is perfectly wise and His timing is perfect, but I struggle with knowing how to be angry at sin without it getting the better of me.  Does that make sense?  If I know He has everything under control, then I shouldn't feel so threatened by the activity of evil to the point I feel I have to defend myself in some futile interchange, but I do.  And I waste my time caught up with people who hate G-d because it serves evil's purpose of distracting me and because I don't know how to get away from them.  It's not like sin you can turn from.  It's people I am connected to.


These people take passages like this Matthew 18 and throw them at us as a way to confuse and further thwart our conviction to turn away from sin and refuse to have anything to do with it. It makes me angry, but I don't know how to handle it or how to get away from feeling threatened spiritually.  G-d tells us to turn from sin.  We can turn the TV off, turn the radio off, read only the Bible and books that rely on scripture for guidance, we can say "no" to a lot of things, but what do when do when people are trying to force sin upon us and when we try to escape, we can't?  It seems naïve to say this now, but now I know there are times when sin is forced upon you and you can't always just turn away from it.  Then you have truly wicked people, who know G-d is and know the difference between good and evil, but intentionally choose evil.  People who don't choose it out of ignorance or because G-d hasn't given them a chance, but because they prefer wickedness and doing things their own way to love, humility and forgiveness.  They want evil. Meanwhile, in my experience, these are the ones throwing passages like Matthew 18 at us as a way to misguide and exploit our loyalty to G-d and our desire to sanctify ourselves according to His will and word. Keep us under their thumb accountable to them instead of serving G-d.


Psalm 58
Do you indeed speak righteousness, you silent ones? Do you judge uprightly, you sons of men? No, in heart you work wickedness; you weigh out the violence of your hands in the earth. The wicked are estranged from the womb; they go astray as soon as they are born, speaking lies.  Their poison is like the poison of a serpent; they are like the deaf cobra that stops its ear, which will not heed the voice of charmers, charming ever so skillfully.  Break their teeth in their mouth, O G-d! Break out the fangs of the young lions, O L-RD!  Let them flow away as waters which run continually; when he bends his bow, let his arrows be as if cut in pieces.  Let them be like a snail which melts away as it goes, like a stillborn child of a woman that they may not see the sun.  Before your pots can feel the burning thorns, He shall take them away as with a whirlwind, as in His living and burning wrath.  The righteous shall rejoice when he sees the vengeance; he shall wash his feet in the blood of the wicked, so that men will say, "surely there is a reward for the righteous; surely He is G-d who judges in the earth."


How do we deal with these wicked people that we can't turn away from?  When I pray like Psalm 58 their is a subtle but real danger I feel in overstepping my bounds into a wrathfulness that is not my place and does not serve a good purpose for me in terms of my own humility and spiritual focus. People who embrace their sin and hate G-d, then try to use His commands as a means to keep us under their thumb scare me; not because they can win overall but because they can waste my time and calling with their exploitation of the goodness of G-d as a means to hold me accountable to them instead of Him. Its an emotional distraction and it makes me mad. We can't turn away from them in the same way we can sin, so what can we do?  I feel like I have to care about pretty much nothing to not get pulled into anger and hostility with these people.  I don't know how to handle people like this in a way that pleases G-d because I think I have some sort of emotional immaturity I am trying to overcome that is effecting my spiritual growth.

[alon]

Mathew 18:21-23 Then Peter came to Him and said, "L-rd, how often shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? Up to seven times."
Yeshua said to him, "I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven.  Therefore the kingdom of heaven is like a certain king who wanted to settle accounts with his servants.

Based on the wording in this passage, do people agree that it is accurate to say that this parable only apples to believers and fellow believers?

Yes, in both the sense that only believers will do it as instructed; and in the sense you are only instructed to be so generous towards brothers and sisters in Yeshua. Those in sin may know the Bible from church or from internet groups that disseminate this knowledge for the purpose of using it against believers. And the church has for so long taught a false theology that we must forgive everyone unconditionally that when we hear these kinds of arguments against us they are hard to overcome. But nowhere does it say we are to become a doormat for sinners. In fact, just the opposite:

Proverbs 8:13 (NKJV) The fear of the Lord is to hate evil; Pride and arrogance and the evil way And the perverse mouth I hate.

We are told to hate evil, as G-d hates evil.

I ask this because there are people who simply hate G-d and sin to hurt Him and destroy the work He is giving us to do.  They are trying to destroy our lives.  This sounds stupid, but I am dealing with what to do with anger about sin and wickedness.  What is our place as G-d is the judge and we are only His servants.   Meanwhile, I have one life to live on this earth and I am sick of wicked people wasting my time with their confusion and exploitation. I know G-d doesn't need me to accomplish anything, but I want to participate in His will and I don't want to be held any more accountable for the time I waste or what I didn't do than I already am. I want to limit the role of sin in my life just like every believer does.

We are not told to waste time with men of evil intent. What we are told is:

Matthew 10:14 (NKJV) And whoever will not receive you nor hear your words, when you depart from that house or city, shake off the dust from your feet.

We are to forgive only those who repent. This is how we were forgiven. One who sincerely comes and is sorry, repenting for what he has done and wanting to restore relationship wit us, that person we forgive:

Luke 17:3 (NKJV) Take heed to yourselves. If your brother sins against you, rebuke him; and if he repents, forgive him.

We know there are people who are working on behalf of the adversary to stop us. Some of them, including us at one time or another, have done so likely in ignorance. But then there are those who do it knowingly.  How do we handle the emotions that come up with them.  I trust G-d, I love Who He is, I am grateful for His patience, and mercy.  I know He is perfectly wise and His timing is perfect, but I struggle with knowing how to be angry at sin without it getting the better of me.  Does that make sense?  If I know He has everything under control, then I shouldn't feel so threatened by the activity of evil to the point I feel I have to defend myself in some futile interchange, but I do.  And I waste my time caught up with people who hate G-d because it serves evil's purpose of distracting me and because I don't know how to get away from them.  It's not like sin you can turn from.  It's people I am connected to.

This is where it becomes emotionally tricky. Sometimes we are bound to friends, coworkers, and most difficult family. Friendships can end or be put on ice until they repent both before God and before you. Coworkers can be dealt with as any other workplace dispute. You do not have to allow them to walk on you just because they know a few selective Bible verses that they don’t even believe in. They certainly will not afford you the same consideration.

Family is different. Sometimes your only recourse is to shun them until they repent. If this is not an option, then whenever they attack I see no place where it says you cannot stand your ground defending your rights. It may mean some form of compromise if they are willing. Family is family. But if they throw out those verses at you about forgiveness, counter with those given here. If you can’t think of them off the top of your head, then ask them if they are willing to be bound by those same verses they are quoting. They won’t if not a believer. But if they do agree, then you have the basis to start reconciliation and maybe get through to them.

These people take passages like this Matthew 18 and throw them at us as a way to confuse and further thwart our conviction to turn away from sin and refuse to have anything to do with it. It makes me angry, but I don't know how to handle it or how to get away from feeling threatened spiritually.  G-d tells us to turn from sin.  We can turn the TV off, turn the radio off, read only the Bible and books that rely on scripture for guidance, we can say "no" to a lot of things, but what do when do when people are trying to force sin upon us and when we try to escape, we can't?  It seems naïve to say this now, but now I know there are times when sin is forced upon you and you can't always just turn away from it.  Then you have truly wicked people, who know G-d is and know the difference between good and evil, but intentionally choose evil.  People who don't choose it out of ignorance or because G-d hasn't given them a chance, but because they prefer wickedness and doing things their own way to love, humility and forgiveness.  They want evil. Meanwhile, in my experience, these are the ones throwing passages like Matthew 18 at us as a way to misguide and exploit our loyalty to G-d and our desire to sanctify ourselves according to His will and word. Keep us under their thumb accountable to them instead of serving G-d.

These kinds of people you must shun. Have as little to do with them as possible. If not possible to evade them or if they continue to attack, you may counterattack with all the force necessary to shut them up. I see nothing in scripture telling me to be a doormat for the wicked.

Psalm 58
Do you indeed speak righteousness, you silent ones? Do you judge uprightly, you sons of men? No, in heart you work wickedness; you weigh out the violence of your hands in the earth. The wicked are estranged from the womb; they go astray as soon as they are born, speaking lies.  Their poison is like the poison of a serpent; they are like the deaf cobra that stops its ear, which will not heed the voice of charmers, charming ever so skillfully.  Break their teeth in their mouth, O G-d! Break out the fangs of the young lions, O L-RD!  Let them flow away as waters which run continually; when he bends his bow, let his arrows be as if cut in pieces.  Let them be like a snail which melts away as it goes, like a stillborn child of a woman that they may not see the sun.  Before your pots can feel the burning thorns, He shall take them away as with a whirlwind, as in His living and burning wrath.  The righteous shall rejoice when he sees the vengeance; he shall wash his feet in the blood of the wicked, so that men will say, "surely there is a reward for the righteous; surely He is G-d who judges in the earth.”


How do we deal with these wicked people that we can't turn away from?  When I pray like Psalm 58 their is a subtle but real danger I feel in overstepping my bounds into a wrathfulness that is not my place and does not serve a good purpose for me in terms of my own humility and spiritual focus. People who embrace their sin and hate G-d, then try to use His commands as a means to keep us under their thumb scare me; not because they can win overall but because they can waste my time and calling with their exploitation of the goodness of G-d as a means to hold me accountable to them instead of Him. Its an emotional distraction and it makes me mad. We can't turn away from them in the same way we can sin, so what can we do?  I feel like I have to care about pretty much nothing to not get pulled into anger and hostility with these people.  I don't know how to handle people like this in a way that pleases G-d because I think I have some sort of emotional immaturity I am trying to overcome that is effecting my spiritual growth.

Proverbs 8:13 (NKJV) The fear of the Lord is to hate evil;
Pride and arrogance and the evil way
And the perverse mouth I hate.

God hates. This idea that He is only love, especially as Yeshua is utter nonsense taught by evil men who founded their own church and who for centuries were able to keep others under their own oppression with such foolishness. It is true we must be careful not to become as they are in our responses. He hates pride, arrogance and perversion more in us than in the non-believer. But still, you can give back as good as you get short of becoming like them.

Leviticus 19:18 (NKJV) You shall not take vengeance, nor bear any grudge against the children of your people, but you shall love your neighbor as yourself: I am the Lord.

This passage makes it very clear who we are to treat with regard. “The children of your people” means the Hebrews in Leviticus. For us today it would mean Meshiachim. However we are also told:

Romans 12:18-21 (NKJV)
18 If it is possible, as much as depends on you, live peaceably with all men. 19 Beloved, do not avenge yourselves, but rather give place to wrath; for it is written, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. 20 Therefore
“If your enemy is hungry, feed him;
If he is thirsty, give him a drink;
For in so doing you will heap coals of fire on his head.”
21 Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

I used to think this passage was utter nonsense. “Coals of fire” is an obvious euphemism for searing their conscience. With most people they’d just take more from you thinking you a dishrag. But when presented to us in church, that “If it is possible” part was always left out. This was made an absolute, which is absolute stupidity even a child can see through. “If it is possible” the advantages are obvious. But if it is not, then don’t be nice to them. Very simple.

Sometimes we can neither escape nor prevail. In tis case, which I believe is the case with all Matthew 5 after the Beatitudes, then we are told:

Matthew 5:11-12 (NKJV)  “Blessed are you when they revile and persecute you, and say all kinds of evil against you falsely for My sake. Rejoice and be exceedingly glad, for great is your reward in heaven, for so they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

Matthew 5:44 (NKJV) But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you,

This one is tricky. I do not believe we are being given this as a prohibition against defending ourselves. But in a society where a Roman soldier could force a person to carry his load, and where striking said soldier was punishable by death, this all is good advice. When facing those in power, at times the smarter thing to do is to take out lumps and yield. The difficult thing is to do it without becoming bitter, hateful and vengeful. This is something I have had to learn as the worst of my medical conditions were caused by Doctors. And they have money, power, prestige; all the tools to make my life hell worse than what they’ve already done. Every moment of every day it is a choice not to be lost in hatred, rage and bitterness towards them. I only forgive them in the sense I give it over to God. My prayer is they will at some point repent. And if God forgives them, so will I. If not, they will one day face His wrath, which will be far more terrible than anything I could do to them.



Sometimes that is all we can do is give it to God. We either believe Him when He says He will repay, or we do not. He will reward us, and He will repay their evil. If they repent and are forgiven, He did as much for us. We’ll still be rewarded. Think of how difficult it must have been for the early believers to have taken Rav Sh’ul into their fellowship. He had been killing their friends and families, now he’d repented and was proclaiming Yeshua! Think what would have been lost had someone sliped a knife between his ribs because they could not let go their hatred.

 If we hold onto bitterness over the things we cannot do anything about, we’ll spread that bitterness to everyone around us. In the case where you have children at home they will also learn to be bitter, a trait that will be passed down to generations.

I hope this helps. If anything else, don't hesitate to ask. And I will pray for you of course. 

Dan C

[Elizabeth]

Thanks, I think I am dealing with the place of emotions and the deceitfulness of the heart. Here is the cycle.

I get upset and angry at people trying to take the choice to turn from evil away from me. They are completely overstepping their bounds to the point I feel I am in danger of overstepping my place before G-d in anger at them. So to try to find my place again, I remember that The L-rd does not rejoice in the death of the wicked and desires all turn from wickedness. (Ezekiel 18:23) I understand it logically, but when I feel threatened with the sin they try to force on me, and like they are trying to hold me accountable to and for them, I just want it to end.  I want them to go away because the bottom line is they want to excuse their sin using me and for me to grow tolerant and dull to it so I don't turn away. I get to a point that I don't care what happens to them.  G-d forgive me, I have felt to the point I don't care if they lose their soul.  I just need to get away.

I try to counter it. I remember Yeshua. I start feeling hopeful for them and hurt on His behalf because I know how much He loves and their is no good that comes from a lost soul. I have remembered at moments verses like Mathew 26:40, and in my mind  it is, "could you not even remain with me one hour?" and I feel I have betrayed Him to lose hope, hate in my heart, and forget the humanity of people. I know He hates sin, but He loves people. When I am in this place, I feel no love for these people, and when I start reminding myself of G-d and what He has done I get emotionally drawn in to the point I pray for them and then the cycle begins again., I believer G-d has told me to stop praying for them. He has shown me the verse Jeremiah 11:14 several times, "Do not pray for these people, or lift up a prayer on their behalf, for I will not listen when they call to Me in their time of trouble." At this point I am terrified for them because if this is true, then what hope do they have? I know He is showing me my limits and I need to find the right heart to get away from this emotional place in a way that pleases and just trusts Him.

Here is what I am learning about myself and my limitations. If sin is between another person and G-d, I can have the right heart as far as I have learned up to now. I can trust G-d enough to pray wholeheartedly for them and that Yeshua's sacrifice is not in vain on their behalf. It is when I feel my prayers and spiritual life is threatened by their sin because they are trying to force their accountability and choices on me that I get pulled back and forth between emotional extremes. I don't know how to withdraw myself in the right heart because the right heart is found in Yeshua and I know He loves. I don't want to feel any satisfaction if He loses a person who He died for, but I can't help but feel happy at the idea of getting away from it if He acts on my behalf and judges them for what they have done to me.


p.s
I just read through this and realized it makes no sense and I really don't understand my place. I know their sin is between them and G-d and my salvation is between me and G-d, but when they try to force their spiritual state on me I start getting emotional and confused. I don't know how to have the right heart and trust G-d to be their G-d without a sense of satisfaction at their retribution, which is not my place because if not but for Yeshua, this would be me. Praise G-d He is G-d.  I am totally confused about my spiritual limits and obligations to people who would rejoice in seeing me become like them, haters of G-d,  when I know if it weren't for the G-d they insult and His covenant of faithfulness I would be. Then I feel satisfaction that He has laid it all out and they will see it, that He told them and they refused to see it.

[alon]

Luke 9:5 (ESV)  And wherever they do not receive you, when you leave that town shake off the dust from your feet as a testimony against them.”

You do not have to worry about people until it makes you sick or so emotional you can't function. If you can, just walk away from them. Family and coworkers are a different thing. With them only tell them what they ask about. Let your life be a witness and if they become interested seeing that then you can talk to them. But try to find someplace where others won't be butting in on the conversation.

The problem where they try to get you to violate your beliefs can be difficult. The best advice I can give yo is to stand your ground and eventually they'll quit trying. My wife used to try to force me to break Shabbat all the time. And she's get angry when I didn't. But she has accepted that I will keep Shabbat and all the moedim now. It gets a bit cool at times, but we give each other the space when it comes to our different faiths.

We have one man in our synagogue who has to work most every one of the moedim. There is no way around it for him. But he gets off soon as he can and we hold most of our celebrations and gatherings late so he can be there. But providing for his family is the higher mitzvah. Sometimes we just have to make things work the best we can.

So I guess what I am saying is just do the best you can to deal with these people. But don't sweat too much over their rejection. You have done your part, so unless they come to you just let it go. Stand your ground where you can and show them you are serious in your commitment and they will back off. It may get a bit lonely, but you'll soon know who your true friends are.

I pray for you and others like you because I know what you are going through. Me, I'm sort of antisocial anyhow so t isn't as bad. But I have felt the sting of rejection by some who were supposedly friends. I've had more than one knife in my back by "friends" as well. I know the pain of a divided ouse and for 2 yrs the lonliness of doing this all on my own, sorting through the manure pile on the internet for a few nuggets of gold I could keep. It's difficult, but the reward is the truth and the promises of Elohim.

So hang tight. We are here for you whether you have questions or just need to vent. I worry when I haven't heard from you and others for a while. I miss your insights from a mother's heart. So hold onto the truth, and I pray God will send you some who are like minded that you won't be alone. Invite them here when He does! We'd love to be a part of the growth of any truly Messianic group. Invite those who have questions as well. We always stand ready to explain what we believe.

Dan

[Elizabeth]

From various verses in the book of Job.  I didn't write the verse numbers as I was thinking this through.

"Your words have upheld him who was stumbling, and you have strengthened feeble knees, but now it comes upon you and you are weary; it touches you, and you are troubled. Is not your reverence your confidence and the integrity of your ways your hope?

This verse just immediately got my attention because I knew G-d was using it to speak to my situation

Remember now, who ever perished being innocent? or where were the upright ever cut-off? Can a mortal be more righteous than G-d? Can a man be more pure than his Maker? If He puts no trust in his servants, if He charges His angels with error, how much more those who dwell in houses of clay, whose foundation is in the dust, who are crushed before a moth."

Another, "who do you think your are" moment for me personally, but I also realized the absurdity of what Job's friend was saying.  It finally struck me. He is trying to make a case for G-d that He is just in Job's suffering because Job is unrighteous and therefore deserves it. Meanwhile, he is in reality making a case against himself as he self-righteously critiques Job as we all perish and are cut-off. Therefore, we are all not innocent or righteous. We know that Yeshua is the only innocent person to ever perish, the only upright person ever cut-off, the only mortal as pure and righteous as G-d, and the only man whose foundation is not dust but the Spirit of G-d.

On some level he is making a case for G-d, but the case is that he is dependent on His omnipotence and omniscience  specifically because he himself has no control over his own sinful state. He has not control over his death. I thought that perhaps his friends odd responses, which have always confused me because they make too much sense, are actually a result of their lack of faith.  Perhaps that is what I have been missing for so long as I have really struggled with this book.

Though they are trying to make a case for G-d, that faith in G-d results in more control over your circumstances, it is distorted as faith in G-d is necessary for us because we have no control over our circumstances.  We have to trust everything to G-d because it is His and we are just a part of something we really can't understand. Perhaps they are trying to avoid the truth of the painful situation because they didn't want to see themselves in Job, that they do not have control over their circumstances and are completely dependent on G-d, which Job himself understood. 

"Naked I came from my mother's womb, and naked shall I return therel The L-RD gave and the L-Rd has taken away; blessed be the name of the L-RD." In all this Job did not sin nor charge G-d with wrong."

G-d is really teaching me throughout this as I have struggled with the book of Job for a long time, and things started clicking as He kind of lead me through the scriptures as it relates to my situation.  It is not my place to contend for G-d. I can't even contend for myself.  They have proven that. And truthfully, when I start feeling like I understand things, I can get a little full of myself. They have put me in a position between them and G-d, and as they put me on trial, the truth is that I can't defend myself.  But that reality they are setting up a case against themselves as much as they are making one against me as it comes down to a mutual need  we all have for Yeshua.   Instead of admitting their need, they would prefer to tear me down to avoid dealing with it.  And I have felt threatened to the point of confusion.

Here's something I finally came to terms with that has also helped me a great deal.  We ALL die at the hands of G-d. That was a big light bulb moment for me because I have struggled with their attack of the love of G-d contrasted with His wrath and why he chooses some people and not others. I have learned to personally love that I will die at His hands.  He created me.  I know He has a plan that is good for me, and it is that much more the adversary can't have.  If He made us, He is completely just in destroying us, period.  Fortunately, He is loving and gracious so here we are being allowed to fumble around with what is His and what we can't handle.

 I love G-d.  I think that's the fundamental difference between me and them.  If he kills the one's who love Him, who are the ones who hate Him to question why He kills them. If the ones who love Him learn they have no place to question Him, why shouldn't the one's who hate Him have to learn the same? I have chosen to depend on G-d for my salvation and they have chosen to depend on blaming everyone including Him to try to argue for their own because they don't want to give up their sin.  I am not saying that is what was happening with Job's friends.  I think it was more about a sense of control and a level of faith, but with these people, I really think it's about loving sin and hating G-d.

Anyway, I have a little better idea of my place because I know G-d doesn't need me to contend for Him or feel sorry for Him. I need to leave that job to Him because I can't handle it and I should know better than try to explain anything to these people or help them overcome their sin as Yeshua is my proof that I can't even do it for myself.   Meanwhile, I don't know how to get away from them.  I guess it's about not getting emotionally pulled in.

[alon]

Wow. All I can add to that is "Omein!"

Baruch HaShem.

Dan C

[Elizabeth]

Thank you! G-d is teaching me a lot and I am learning a lot about myself. Sometimes I worry about sharing it on here because of how it may come across.  It may come across as too sentimental to some people and it can also feed into a sense of pride for me if I am not careful. So I will just share here as a way to thank G-d.  This is the place He has given me to reach out to people, and also to give what He gives back to Him instead of keeping it like its my own.   I will give it to you all, and bless you the way you do me.

G-d is so gracious and giving toward us that it can be overwhelming when you feel so loved and blessed to get to know Him. It leaves me with what do I do with it? One way He has been teaching me is as I read through the scriptures, He is kind of slowing me down so I see the people I am reading about on a really tender level. Here and there I get a glimpse of a moment that was between Him and one of His children that is precious and full of love and delight on His part toward them. I have kind of met one person gradually at a time; Mary, John the Baptist, David, Abraham; Mary who anointed Him, Joseph the son of Jacob, Joseph Yeshua's earthly father, Sarah, and lately Hannah.

I hope it continues because I am so blessed by them; just that glimpse of how dear they are to Him and they become dear to me. I know He doesn't forget His people, and He indeed "keeps his faith to those asleep in the dust" because it is so important to Him that I see them.  I feel Him saying , "do you see, wait, don't you see", like He just wants me to look at someone so beautiful to Him and see. He is growing my heart for Israel in those moments. It is often in that moment that their Hebrew name comes to me. It's really beautiful because I see a bit of how He feels about them and that's their name. That's how He knows them and I am blessed He is sharing that moment with me.  I can't help but bless Israel and be happy for Him over those individuals.  I have to agree with Him that he has beautiful children and I am blessed that He has shared them with me.  Israel has blessed the world, and I see it.

Then, I see those who love Yeshua and love serving Him and all the sense of insecurity about not having a congregation leaves in that moment because all I can be is grateful that there are people praying to Him and serving Him. I haven't gotten to meet many at all, but I am just happy for Him that He has you all.  He knows each one, sees each one, and I can bless you with Him by just taking a moment to rejoice with all He has.  Again,  that I am very blessed just to be even a small part of what He has done.  

G-d works around life circumstances.  I feel really lonely without a congregation sometimes, but instead of rushing to what's next, He has helped me by slowing me down to just bless and be happy with Him for His people and all of you. He has overcome a lot of my fellowship issues in this.  I know G-d takes His children very seriously and He wants me to.  I think that deep love for His people is why He is also wrathful of those who try to steal His away from Him. I just keep coming back to that we need to be really careful with each other. He is very serious about us and we are very blessed that He would share such a gift with us. 

Romans 14: 7-13
For none of us lives to himself, and none of us dies to himself.  For if we live, we live to the Lord, and if we die, we die to the Lord.  So then, whether we live or whether we die, we are the Lord’s.  For to this end Messiah died and lived again, that he might be Lord both of the dead and of the living. Why do you pass judgment on your brother? Or you, why do you despise your brother? For we will all stand before the judgment seat of God; for it is written, “As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.” So then each of us will give an account of himself to God. Do not Cause Another to stumble. Therefore let us not pass judgment on one another any longer, but rather decide never to put a stumbling block or hindrance in the way of a brother.

[alon]

Pastor and author Ed Cole used to say "Take the gold, but leave the glory." Sometimes Elohim gives us these insights, and when we write them down it is easy to become proud; proud "we" saw it and wrote about it, or just proud He showed it to us! El is faithful to share these truths with those who look. They edify us, and lift us spiritually. And I believe He means for us to share the things he shows us. But sometimes it can be as much to teach us not to become too proud of what He does through us as it is to share with others. Like you I must often remind myself that any talent I have was given by God. And it is He who at times enhances that talent, or even just blesses me with something that undeniably came straight from His hand. So while we may justifiably be proud of what we do for God or the fact He chooses to work through us, that pride must be checked, tempered by the understanding that without Him we did nothing:

Jeremiah 9:23-24 (ESV) Thus says the Lord: “Let not the wise man boast in his wisdom, let not the mighty man boast in his might, let not the rich man boast in his riches,  but let him who boasts boast in this, that he understands and knows me, that I am the Lord who practices steadfast love, justice, and righteousness in the earth. For in these things I delight, declares the Lord.”

HaShem did not just give dictation when He inspired holy writ. He gave men insights then allowed them to write. They did so faithfully and truthfully, but their personalties, perspectives, characters and world-views came through in their writings. It is humbling both to think He does te same for you, me and anyone else here. t is also humbling to think that what those men wrote ended up in the Bible for countless millions to read. What I write ends up here for, in rare cases and when I am lucky countless (because they choose to lurk   ) individuals to maybe read all the way through. 

“For pride is spiritual cancer: it eats up the very possibility of love, or contentment, or even common sense.” C.S. Lewis

Pride is one of the things w are supposed to overcome, to tame and to keep in its place. So never feel ashamed of being proud, taking pride in what you do. It's a necessary part of who we are. But never let it get away from you either, because it will destroy you and the very work which you are so proud of. Be proud in Him, of Him and through Him. And in all things give Him the glory. 

I do believe HaShem gives you insights and a perspective I could never have. That is how He works. It's how we make up the body, each having a different function. So I encourage you, as I do others to continue to share here. And if (more like when) our posts sometimes only get a few hits, remember that God's economy is not our economy. If only one person reads what we write, trust HaShem that was the one person in all the world that really needed to get maybe even just one thing out of everything we wrote. But not to have written it would have been to cheat both that person and HaShem.

Dan C

[garrett]

This has been a really good topic for me to read. Though I don't yet have a way to fully compose my thoughts about all of it, the things that have been brought up have applied to my life as well.

One scripture comes to my mind that "G-d is not the author of confusion," and with that I'm reminded about the way I try to handle others, myself and my own thoughts. Some things have been said here that are good for me to remember, especially shunning those who would try to bring evil into my life - whether family, friends or people that I barely know. And to be resolute to simply sticking to what I've chosen to believe in. This is a way to shun "wrong things" even if we're forced to be in some peoples' presence.

I agree that it's safe to be proud in what we know and have learned by the grace of G-d. That is a good pride, to be proud of Him (!). There are so many people and distractions that try to pull us in so many directions that it could make the most sane person go crazy. So many things we read (apart from the Bible) or hear or see try to make us double-minded. This is not what G-d intends for us.

Be proud in what G-d has revealed to you and take comfort in it. Even the worst times of weakness and doubt always pass - to be replaced with the confidence that we recognize. That's the time when we can bask in that confidence.

garrett