Talking haSatan

[Questor]

There is a good deal of difference in talking about the Devil, as Westerners would say, between Pagans of all sorts and Judaism, or Messianic Judaism...if there is a difference in views toward haSatan.

I am aware that our idea of haSatan is somewhat as a Prosecutor in a court case, and the 'accuser of the Bretheren', presumably to G-d, but I seem to be the one hearing him.

So who is the Tempter that is featured so much in Scripture.  Is he the same thing as the Adversary, and what is his name, from our point of view.

As for Lucifer, I am aware that he can be a mere Literary device taken too seriously by the Greco-Romans, who in fact seemed to name him. 

But if we have a fallen Cherubim in actuality, I would like to know how to deal with said Cherubim.

[alon]

Mar 4, 2017 22:49:36 GMT -8 Questor said:

There is a good deal of difference in talking about the Devil, as Westerners would say, between Pagans of all sorts and Judaism, or Messianic Judaism...if there is a difference in views toward haSatan.

I am aware that our idea of haSatan is somewhat as a Prosecutor in a court case, and the 'accuser of the Bretheren', presumably to G-d, but I seem to be the one hearing him.

So who is the Tempter that is featured so much in Scripture.  Is he the same thing as the Adversary, and what is his name, from our point of view.

As for Lucifer, I am aware that he can be a mere Literary device taken too seriously by the Greco-Romans, who in fact seemed to name him. 

But if we have a fallen Cherubim in actuality, I would like to know how to deal with said Cherubim.

Not sure what you mean by "hearing him" (the devil), but we all hear the self-talk in our heads. Not necessarily his voice, but thoughts that originate from the enemy. We are told we are part of a spiritual war:

Ephesians 6:12 (KJV)  For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

And we are told that ha'satan is out to get us:

2 Corinthians 2:11 (KJV)  Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices.

So the enemy is a real spiritual being, and he is described variously in scripture:

Matthew 4:3 (KJV)  And when the tempter came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread.

Revelation 12:10 (KJV) And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

John 8:44 (KJV)  Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

In his book "Know Your Enemy" Dr. Michael Youssef breaks ha'satan down into a seven point profile:

1. The enemy believes in questioning authority. 

Genesis 3:1 (KJV)  Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

Adam and Chava walked more closely with G-d than anyone. In order to deceive them, they were enticed to question the authority of their G-d. Then they were told if they ate, they could be their own god, judging for themselves what is right and wrong.

Genesis 3:4-5 (KJV)  And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:  For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

2. The enemy goes to church (synagogue)

1 Timothy 4:1 (KJV)  Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 

3. The enemy wants to meet your needs

Basically where is your focus? Is it on G-d and the things of G-d? Or is it on yourself? If one, it is G-d who will meet your needs. If the other, your needs are being met by the enemy of your soul. I always think of Yehoshua's last address when this question comes up.

Joshua 24:15 (KJV)  And if it seem evil unto you to serve the Lord, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.

4. The enemy is a supreme forger

He copies G-d in all he does. It is even the worship due G-d that he covets! from the Garden when he told Chave she could be like G-d, judging good from evil for herself, right up until the End Times he copies what he knows from his long association with G-d before the fall.

Revelation 13:13-14 (KJV)  And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

5. The enemy detests the down and out

Why is it the wicked seem to always prosper while those who truly wish to help others seem to just have enough to get by? Why, when we've spent billions each year to eradicate poverty does it seem there is more poverty each year? Drugs, alcohol, abuse and human trafficking seems to always increase. And once you are in this kind of total bondage and despair it is next to impossible to come back. Most who do succeed with the help of G-d; but even these I've seen relapse time and again. Someone, or more to the point some thing does not want you to prosper, or even work up from rock bottom.

6. The enemy disguises falsehood with truth

The saying goes "the best lies have an element of truth." That is no lie, right there. It's that small element of truth that sucks us in. That makes the rest believable; or in most cases just palatable. We saw in John 8:44 above that the enemy is a liar. This is one of the main tricks he uses to deceive us.

7. The enemy never attacks from the front

I have to disagree here. The enemy attacks from whatever position is most advantageous to him. If he is strong enough in our life and a full frontal assault will topple us so that he can use us as an example against G-d, then he attacks from the front.

However I will say he does prefer the oblique assault on our flanks or rear. And the most preferable is to attack from within. Lason hara within the body is the best tool for this. To entertain a gossip or busybody is the best way to destroy a congregation. Note the prayer Yeshua prayed in the garden of Gesthemane just before His execution:

John 17:21 (KJV)  That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

That we'd be one; unified. Not divided by petty jealousies, bickering, disobedience, gossip, or any of the other things that bring division.


You will notice that I don't capitalize any of the "names" of the enemy. In point of fact, he has no name. I believe it was removed by G-d at the fall, and all the so called names for him in the Bible are descriptions, not names.  In Job and Zechariah the definite article "ha" precedes the noun, as in "ha'satan" (litterally "the satan" or "the accuser"). In 1 Chronicles it appears without the definite article, so some argue it should be or is a proper name. They can believe what they want.

But in mid-eastern thought, removal of a persons name from all records and prohibiting it even to be spoken was the worst insult. It was like saying you don't matter; your memory will be wiped out. "Lucifer" (light bearer) describes an office, not a name. This title is as close as we get to a name for the enemy. To me he is ha'satan. I refuse to give him back what G-d took from him. That he has hoodwinked the church into doing this is one of his great achievements. 

Hope this helped.

Dan C

[jimmie]

Num 22:22 And God's anger was kindled because he went: and the angel of the LORD stood in the way for an adversary (satan) against him. Now he was riding upon his ass, and his two servants were with him.


Num 22:32 And the angel of the LORD said unto him, Wherefore hast thou smitten thine ass these three times? behold, I went out to withstand (satan) thee, because thy way is perverse before me:

Here God declares himself satan: or against Balaam. Just make sure you are listing to the satan who is an adversary of Baal, Bel, Dagon et.al.

[garrett]

This is good information. I've been trying to catch up on my reading so this has been helpful. Thanks guys.


garrett