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Post by mystic on Oct 26, 2016 2:18:20 GMT -8
I just started reading the NT so of course I am going to disect everything which is not clear to me so please excuse this? I had asked this topic a while back on one of the other forums and one person had said it was not meant to be take literally but I don't see it that way, what's your thoughts on this please, was Jesus telling us to let anyone physically harm us or not?
But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. 40 And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well. 41 If anyone forces you to go one mile, go with them two miles.
moderator note: post moved to its' proper category
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Post by alon on Oct 26, 2016 13:32:34 GMT -8
I just started reading the NT so of course I am going to disect everything which is not clear to me so please excuse this? I had asked this topic a while back on one of the other forums and one person had said it was not meant to be take literally but I don't see it that way, what's your thoughts on this please, was Jesus telling us to let anyone physically harm us or not? But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. 40 And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well. 41 If anyone forces you to go one mile, go with them two miles.
No need to apologize. this kind of question is why this board exists.
Matthew 5:39 (NASB) But I say to you, do not resist an evil person; but whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also.
This must be understood contextually. First off, we need to look at it in context of the times. Israel was under Roman domination at the time, This was a cruel, oppressive occupation. Another verse in these instructions is:
Matthew 5:41 (NASB) Whoever forces you to go one mile, go with him two.
This is a specific reference: A Roman soldier could force you to carry his pack and any other load for him. And that brings us to the next contextual consideration. Mat 5:39 is part of the Sermon on the Mount, where Yeshua gave us instructions about how our general attitude should be, especially in an oppressive society. Turn the other cheek is also specific to the Roman occupation, because striking a soldier who first struck you would likely get you killed.
Is this applicable today? Strike a cop, even if you think it justified, and find out. Better to turn the other cheek and deal with the offense in court.
These are general instructions about how our attitude should be. Sitting around plotting revenge destroys you, not the object of your hatred. And actually taking revenge makes you the sinner/criminal.
Deuteronomy 32:35 (KJV) To me belongeth vengeance and recompence; their foot shall slide in due time: for the day of their calamity is at hand, and the things that shall come upon them make haste.
Romans 12:19 (KJV) Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.
Most people, even in our own society are to some extent at the mercy of the rich and powerful. Jewish law provided recompense for being struck, even to a slave. And there were cities of refuge where you could go if you killed someone while defending your own life. So Yeshua could not have been saying don't defend yourself. But the wealthy will destroy you again in court, so like being struck by a Roman soldier, what good would it do you to sue? But there is coming a day when they will be held accountable:
James 5:1-9 (ESV) Come now, you rich, weep and howl for the miseries that are coming upon you. Your riches have rotted and your garments are moth-eaten. Your gold and silver have corroded, and their corrosion will be evidence against you and will eat your flesh like fire. You have laid up treasure in the last days. Behold, the wages of the laborers who mowed your fields, which you kept back by fraud, are crying out against you, and the cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord of hosts. You have lived on the earth in luxury and in self-indulgence. You have fattened your hearts in a day of slaughter. You have condemned and murdered the righteous person. He does not resist you. Be patient, therefore, brothers, until the coming of the Lord. See how the farmer waits for the precious fruit of the earth, being patient about it, until it receives the early and the late rains. You also, be patient. Establish your hearts, for the coming of the Lord is at hand. Do not grumble against one another, brothers, so that you may not be judged; behold, the Judge is standing at the door.
So Yeshua is not saying just give up and allow your family to be attacked or reduced to living under a bridge. These are general instructions concerning our attitude, not absolute instructions for every scenario. We are to trust in Elohim, not sit around plotting revenge or harboring hatred. And don't tilt at windmills. They will eventually crumble, but our reward will last forever.
Dan C
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Post by mystic on Oct 29, 2016 2:59:02 GMT -8
Got it, thanks.
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Post by Elizabeth on Jan 14, 2018 8:13:56 GMT -8
Yesterday evening I saw a man wearing a light coat and seemingly homeless walking along the side of the road in like 16 degree weather on ice and snow. I have been praying to G-d about being more charitabale, asking for Him to show me opportunities to help people more. I just couldn't drive past this man because he could literally die in this situation without shelter. I turned around to offer assistance. He wanted me to drive him to a different town. I said I was uncomfortable letting someone in my car and asked him to wait inside a warm restaurant while I went to an ATM to get some money so we could call him a cab. He refused and every suggestion he made involved getting in my car. I practically begged him to just wait, increasing the cash I would offer him, and promised to return with it, but he refused. I ended up driving off as he said he would call someone. I know I would have been completely stupid to agree to let this man in my car but I still feel guilty and doubt myself.
This morning in study this scripture came up and I wondered if I did the right thing again. Your explanation helped Alon, but I feel guilty and wonder if I didn't trust G-d. This is one kind of confusion I repeatedly get pulled into. I had dreams as a child where I felt sorry for the devil. I know it's sick and it's part of the reason I am struggling now with these demons; some twisted idea of compassion and boundary confusion. I need help drawing lines for myself and understanding how to follow G-d because I am pretty sure the adversary is trying to exploit this confusion.
I had two kids sitting at home waiting for me to come back with their Saturday evening ice cream, and I feel guilty about not putting my life in danger for someone who seems like could have only had evil in his heart. Meanwhile I am feeling guilty assuming the worst even though it's completely illogical that a needy person would refuse cash and he kept wanting to get in my car. I keep seeing his face in my mind when I first pulled over and it was cruel. I noticed this initially but upon talking I pushed it away. Something is really wrong with me and discernment or boundaries or something.
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Post by alon on Jan 14, 2018 10:52:58 GMT -8
Yesterday evening I saw a man wearing a light coat and seemingly homeless walking along the side of the road in like 16 degree weather on ice and snow. I have been praying to G-d about being more charitabale, asking for Him to show me opportunities to help people more. I just couldn't drive past this man because he could literally die in this situation without shelter. I turned around to offer assistance. He wanted me to drive him to a different town. I said I was uncomfortable letting someone in my car and asked him to wait inside a warm restaurant while I went to an ATM to get some money so we could call him a cab. He refused and every suggestion he made involved getting in my car. I practically begged him to just wait, increasing the cash I would offer him, and promised to return with it, but he refused. I ended up driving off as he said he would call someone. I know I would have been completely stupid to agree to let this man in my car but I still feel guilty and doubt myself. This morning in study this scripture came up and I wondered if I did the right thing again. Your explanation helped Alon, but I feel guilty and wonder if I didn't trust G-d. This is one kind of confusion I repeatedly get pulled into. I had dreams as a child where I felt sorry for the devil. I know it's sick and it's part of the reason I am struggling now with these demons; some twisted idea of compassion and boundary confusion. I need help drawing lines for myself and understanding how to follow G-d because I am pretty sure the adversary is trying to exploit this confusion. I had two kids sitting at home waiting for me to come back with their Saturday evening ice cream, and I feel guilty about not putting my life in danger for someone who seems like could have only had evil in his heart. Meanwhile I am feeling guilty assuming the worst even though it's completely illogical that a needy person would refuse cash and he kept wanting to get in my car. I keep seeing his face in my mind when I first pulled over and it was cruel. I noticed this initially but upon talking I pushed it away. Something is really wrong with me and discernment or boundaries or something. Elizabeth, you are a good person, and I think you are tormenting yourself unnecessarily. A jerk wouldn't worry about these things. But here is the thing: you should never put yourself in danger and you should trust your gut, which you did. If your gut tells you something is wrong then listen to it. And in this case reason and common sense says there was something wrong! You did exactly the right thing. In fact, you did more than I would have. The only thing I might suggest you could have done is call the police. They can deal with someone like, and maybe keep him from getting in someone else's car down the road. But you did right getting home to those kids. Dan
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Post by jimmie on Jan 17, 2018 15:43:17 GMT -8
Elizabeth, you chose providing for your family which was the correct choice: I Tim 5:8 But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.
Now you should rest in that choice with out doubt: Mark 11:23 For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith.
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