Post by alon on Jul 10, 2014 1:12:44 GMT -8
Mat 18:18-20 (ESV) Truly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven. Again I say to you, if two of you agree on earth about anything they ask, it will be done for them by my Father in heaven. For where two or three are gathered in my name, there am I among them.”
SO what does this mean? Is it as the churches tell us that whenever two or more believers get together, Yeshua will be with them? On the surface, I suppose He is if they are speaking of Spiritual things. But what does He mean whenn He says "I am there with them?"
Contextually Yeshua is speaking about these believers "binding" and "loosing" things in heaven and earth. To loose is an idiom for alllowing a thing or things, and to bind is to disallow. Yeshua is giving His talmidim the authority to make halacha- that is to tell people how they are to keep
. To bind or loose in heaven means He is OK with what they decide, and to do so on earth is to require believers to do as they say. Now, I don't know about you, but to me this doesn't seem like He is speaking to just any believers. New believers generally do not even have the knowlege or authority to decide how THEY will keep , let alone anyone else. Preposterous to think Yeshua means just anyone who believes! Taken in context, it is foolish to think that whatever a couple of new believers ask for would be automatically granted, or that what tey say would carry any weight. And some believers never grow much, it seems.
Yeshua is making these men shaliachim- His representatives here on earth. Christians call them apostles. They are the knowlegeable ones who've studied. They are the ones who have experience testing the spirits. And they are the ones judged worthy to lead. And they are the ones given the authority to make halacha based on their qualifications, judgement and character.
The key is vs. 19:
Mat 18:19 YLT`Again, "I say to you, that, if two of you may agree on the earth concerning anything, whatever they may ask."
They had to ask someone ... "there am I among them” means they are to go to God with their rulings. They didn't just go off and decide how THEY wanted it to be. No, they would prayerfully search scripture as well as gather all the details from congregants and then decide. Halacha changes with circumstances. Near the Arctic Circle for instance, a Messianic would probably go by a calendar and a clock to determine when Shabbat is- since they have only one day and one night per year. Their halacha would be different than mine, where I have 7 distinct days and nights each week. If I could only count to 7, I wouldn't even need my calendar!
Mat 1:1 "At that time the disciples came to Jesus, saying, ..." This tells us Yeshua is talking to His talmidim here.
So whenever two or more Rabbis, duely ordained and who are always responsible to and subject to review by higher Rabbinical oversight agree, then they make our halacha- the decissions on exactly how we keep the mitzvoth. Of course, we willingly subject ourselves to their authority. When I joined Synagogue Beit Aveinu I agreed to abide by the mitzvoth as interpreted by the Light Beit Din. I sometimes struggle with compliance, but I never dispute their authority.
Others here fall under the authority of other ruling organizations, and some have not yet found a place where they can trust the rulings of their Rabbis. For those with no place to call enlightened, I always suggest adopting the halacha of the forum sponsors- Synagogue Chavurat HaMashiach on most things. But if you are new to Messianic Judaism, don't just go and try to figure all this out on your own. Those of us raised in Christian churches and schools that follow the Greek model are not qualified to dig deeper into the meanings of the Scriptures. Did you, for example, know what Yeshua was talking about here before reading this post?
Dan C
SO what does this mean? Is it as the churches tell us that whenever two or more believers get together, Yeshua will be with them? On the surface, I suppose He is if they are speaking of Spiritual things. But what does He mean whenn He says "I am there with them?"
Contextually Yeshua is speaking about these believers "binding" and "loosing" things in heaven and earth. To loose is an idiom for alllowing a thing or things, and to bind is to disallow. Yeshua is giving His talmidim the authority to make halacha- that is to tell people how they are to keep
. To bind or loose in heaven means He is OK with what they decide, and to do so on earth is to require believers to do as they say. Now, I don't know about you, but to me this doesn't seem like He is speaking to just any believers. New believers generally do not even have the knowlege or authority to decide how THEY will keep , let alone anyone else. Preposterous to think Yeshua means just anyone who believes! Taken in context, it is foolish to think that whatever a couple of new believers ask for would be automatically granted, or that what tey say would carry any weight. And some believers never grow much, it seems.Yeshua is making these men shaliachim- His representatives here on earth. Christians call them apostles. They are the knowlegeable ones who've studied
. They are the ones who have experience testing the spirits. And they are the ones judged worthy to lead. And they are the ones given the authority to make halacha based on their qualifications, judgement and character. The key is vs. 19:
Mat 18:19 YLT`Again, "I say to you, that, if two of you may agree on the earth concerning anything, whatever they may ask."
They had to ask someone ... "there am I among them” means they are to go to God with their rulings. They didn't just go off and decide how THEY wanted it to be. No, they would prayerfully search scripture as well as gather all the details from congregants and then decide. Halacha changes with circumstances. Near the Arctic Circle for instance, a Messianic would probably go by a calendar and a clock to determine when Shabbat is- since they have only one day and one night per year. Their halacha would be different than mine, where I have 7 distinct days and nights each week. If I could only count to 7, I wouldn't even need my calendar!
Mat 1:1 "At that time the disciples came to Jesus, saying, ..." This tells us Yeshua is talking to His talmidim here.
So whenever two or more Rabbis, duely ordained and who are always responsible to and subject to review by higher Rabbinical oversight agree, then they make our halacha- the decissions on exactly how we keep the mitzvoth. Of course, we willingly subject ourselves to their authority. When I joined Synagogue Beit Aveinu I agreed to abide by the mitzvoth as interpreted by the
Light Beit Din. I sometimes struggle with compliance, but I never dispute their authority. Others here fall under the authority of other ruling organizations, and some have not yet found a place where they can trust the rulings of their Rabbis. For those with no place to call enlightened, I always suggest adopting the halacha of the forum sponsors- Synagogue Chavurat HaMashiach on most things. But if you are new to Messianic Judaism, don't just go and try to figure all this out on your own. Those of us raised in Christian churches and schools that follow the Greek model are not qualified to dig deeper into the meanings of the Scriptures. Did you, for example, know what Yeshua was talking about here before reading this post?
Dan C
