Matthew 23:1-4 scribes and Pharisees

[alon]

Matthew 23:1-4, "Then Yeshua addressed the crowds and his talmidim: "The -teachers and the P'rushim," he said, "sit in the seat of Moshe. So whatever they tell you, take care to do it. But don't do what they do, because they talk but don't act! They tie heavy loads onto people's shoulders but won't lift a finger to help carry them."

In my notes I have that the hypocritical scribes and Pharisees were mostly students of Shamai. Yeshua was very likely from the school of Hilel, which was more lenient and observant. It is erroneously taught that all Pharisees were this hypocritical, and that Yeshua spoke of every Pharisee here. Also, the first part is always ignored, where Yeshua commands us to obey all that the Pharisees tell us!

Comments or corrections? Thx.

Dan C

Edit: I correct part of this myself in posts 7 & 8 below, after further study on this passage.

[messianicmama]

I concur. On all interpretations of that Yeshua gave he lined up closely with Hillel. The only exception was on acceptable grounds fir divorce. Hillel said anything from burning your eggs on up and Shamai said only adultery. Yeshua agreed with Shamai, but added that Gd hated divorce and it was only permitted because of the hard heartedness of mankind.

[Frank T. Clark]

Iaushua is GOD so He is correct and all others agree or disagree with Him. It is not ever the other way around lest we become confused. He was not from any school. He was the Teacher of the only school.

YES, He repeated that we should obey the Law of Moses.

Mal 4:4 Remember ye the law of Moses my servant, which I commanded unto him in Horeb for all Israel, with the statutes and judgments.

[alon]

Jul 3, 2013 4:11:56 GMT -8 Frank T. Clark said:

Iaushua is GOD so He is correct and all others agree or disagree with Him. It is not ever the other way around lest we become confused. He was not from any school. He was the Teacher of the only school.

Frank, the key to your post is your affirmation (with which I concur) that Yeshua is God. He is referred to many times in scripture as "the Word." "In the beginning, the Word ... ." He was there from the start.

I would suggest that it was Yeshua who gave the Law to Moses. It was He who set up the priesthood and the Hebraic courts by Divine revelation. He authored the entire TNK in the same manner. And it is a fact that God can never disagree with Himself.

So whenever we find doctrines and interpretations of the B'rit Chadasha (also Divinely inspired) which disagree with the TNK, I'd further suggest we need to humble ourselves in prayer and genuinely search ALL scripture to find the truth.

Genesis to Revelation- one book, one author, one message.

Dan C

[Frank T. Clark]

Jul 3, 2013 11:15:27 GMT -8 alon said:

Genesis to Revelation- one book, one author, one message.

Fantastic statement. I agree wholeheartedly, absolutely, and completely. Iaushua plainly said that no man has seen the Father. Therefore, the God seen and heard in the Original Testament is Iaushua. I would also mention that He and the Father are in complete harmony, purpose, and agreement. As He said. The Father and I are one. If you have seen me, you have seen the Father. And of course, the Holy Spirit is included in that combination.

God cannot contradict Himself and His Word is true. If we think we have found a contradiction in the Renewed Testament, then we are wrong and must study further to find the truth which will resolve any contradiction. God does not lie or mislead.

[Micha'el]

Shalom!
This entire chapter (Matt 23) is an opportunity for Ha Shem to show us how far from Him we have strayed. Yeshua is most definitely disappointed with the way those in positions of authority have handled their positions. May we always be found trying to lead others to draw closer to Him and encouraging all good steps taken towards a closer walk with Him.
Micha’el

[alon]

Jul 15, 2013 9:54:54 GMT -8 Micha'el said:

Shalom!
This entire chapter (Matt 23) is an opportunity for Ha Shem to show us how far from Him we have strayed.

You just had to go and say that, huh?

But it was timely. I'm being asked to step up my ministries at the AoG church where I worship the first of every week. And, honestly, I can negatively relate to most of what Yeshua is saying here. We're all human, just some of us have more human characteristics than others! [img src=".gif" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">i7.photobucket.com/albums/y296/chobb/Sm/.gif"][/img]

I suppose Mat 23 could be read as a warning to those who 'seat themselves in the seat of Moshe': those who seek or accept positions of leadership, authority or teaching.

Not the only warning of its kind; James 3:1 obviously comes to mind. The TNK was even more summary in its judgment, ""'But if a prophet presumptuously speaks a word in my name which I didn't order him to say, or if he speaks in the name of other gods, then that prophet must die.'" Deu 18:20.

Thx for the reality check.

Dan

[alon]

I've done some more on this, and it appears that Mat 23:1-4 has some serious translational errors. First off, it disagrees with what Yeshua says in the rest of the chapter, as well as Mat 15 and others. Now, since Yeshua and the Father are one, and God cannot contradict Himself, I have to think there is either a problem in my understanding or in the translation. Third option is God has a problem, and that one is not possible.

Fortunately there is a copy of the original Hebrew document still in existence, called "Shem Tov's Hebrew Matthew," and it clears up much.

Mat 23:1-3 “Then Yeshua addressed the crowds and his talmidim; "The -teachers and the P'rushim," he said, "sit in the seat of Moshe. So whatever they tell you, take care to do it.”
In English xlated from the Greek, this says do obey the Pharasees.

Mat 23:2-3 in English xlated from the Hebrew says “The Pharisees and sages sit on the seat of Moses. Therefore all that he says to you, diligently do; but according to their reforms and their precedents do not do, because they talk but they do not do."Now that's a whole different message! And one that is consistent with the rest of Yeshua's teachings! The "he" apparently refers to Moses, and we are to do as "he" says. We are not to follow the "reforms" and "precedents" of the Pharisees- in other words don't do as they say to or as they do.

For example, in Mat 15:3, 6 “He answered, "Indeed, why do you break the command of God by your tradition? … then he is rid of his duty to honor his father or mother.' Thus by your tradition you make null and void the word of God!”Doesn't sound like He is trying to convince anyone to follow the example of these Pharisees.

In the original Hebrew version is presented a consistent message to obey , but warns not to follow the instructions of the Pharisees.

(continued)

[alon]

In Greek Mat 5 Yeshua says 6 times “You have heard it said … but I say …” This sounds like He is changing ; for example: Mat 5:33-34 “Again, ye have heard that it hath been said by them of old time, Thou shalt not forswear thyself , but shalt perform unto the Lord thine oaths: But I say unto you, Swear not at all;” Swear not at all!?

Exodus 3:15 “Say this to the people of Yisra'el: 'Yud-Heh-Vav-Heh [YHVH, Yahova], the Elohim of your fathers, Elohim Avraham, Elohim Yitz'chak, v’Elohim Ya'akov, has sent me to you. 'This is my memorial ( Heb zechar) forever; this is how I am to be remembered generation after generation.”

In Hebrew, zechar has a much broader meaning. It can mean say it in your mind, or speak it. Exodus 23:13 “do not invoke the names of other gods or even let them be heard crossing your lips.” The word used is zechar. Clearly zechar refers to saying a name. So according to Ex 3:15, we should say His name as Yahova as a memorial to Him.

Deu 6:13 “You are to fear ADONAI/ YHVH your God, serve him and swear by his name.”
Deu 10:20 “You are to fear ADONAI/ YHVH your God, serve him, cling to him and swear by his name.”

Jer 12:16 “Then, if they will carefully learn my people's ways, swearing by my name, 'As YHVH lives,' just as they taught my people to swear by Ba'al, they will be built up among my people.” This is one of the few places in the TNK it speaks directly to gentiles.It says we must learn to swear “As YHVH lives!” in order to be saved.

The Greek translation told us in Mat 5:33-34 (above) not to swear. In Hebrew Matthew Yeshua says in that same vs. “you must not swear by anything falsely.” When He says “Let your yes be yes and your no be no” in Mat 5:37 Yeshua is saying if you swear an oath it had better be the truth! Yeshua is not changing , He is bringing out the underlying principle that you should swear truthfully!

Unfortunately this error is echoed in James 5:12, for which we have no original Hebrew text. While this could shed some doubt on the meaning of the Hebrew Mat 5:37, I believe the Hebrew text to be correct. This would mean that the Greek James 5 is wrong as well, because the words of Yeshua are necessarily true; also He cannot contradict Himself in either the NT or the TNK, which the Greek translation of James 5 (probably originally written by inspiration in Hebrew), clearly does.

Yeshua nor the Ruach HaChodesh ever did nor could change anything from the , nor indeed the entire TNK; nor could they contradict anything in the B'rit Chadasha. Genesis to Revelation, the Bible is one book with one unified and inerrant message! But only in its original form, which man has often intentionally and sometimes unintentionally perverted. However, the Word is powerful, and the truth is there for us to see, even after the centuries of evil from Constantine through the Roman church's domination, and all the attempts to change the Word of God to suit evil men!

Dan C

[Yedidyah]

Sept 7, 2013 12:30:02 GMT -8 alon said:

In Greek Mat 5 Yeshua says 6 times “You have heard it said … but I say …” This sounds like He is changing ; for example: Mat 5:33-34 “Again, ye have heard that it hath been said by them of old time, Thou shalt not forswear thyself , but shalt perform unto the Lord thine oaths: But I say unto you, Swear not at all;” Swear not at all!?

Exodus 3:15 “Say this to the people of Yisra'el: 'Yud-Heh-Vav-Heh [YHVH, Yahova], the Elohim of your fathers, Elohim Avraham, Elohim Yitz'chak, v’Elohim Ya'akov, has sent me to you. 'This is my memorial ( Heb zechar) forever; this is how I am to be remembered generation after generation.”

In Hebrew, zechar has a much broader meaning. It can mean say it in your mind, or speak it. Exodus 23:13 “do not invoke the names of other gods or even let them be heard crossing your lips.” The word used is zechar. Clearly zechar refers to saying a name. So according to Ex 3:15, we should say His name as Yahova as a memorial to Him.

Deu 6:13 “You are to fear ADONAI/ YHVH your God, serve him and swear by his name.”
Deu 10:20 “You are to fear ADONAI/ YHVH your God, serve him, cling to him and swear by his name.”

Jer 12:16 “Then, if they will carefully learn my people's ways, swearing by my name, 'As YHVH lives,' just as they taught my people to swear by Ba'al, they will be built up among my people.” This is one of the few places in the TNK it speaks directly to gentiles.It says we must learn to swear “As YHVH lives!” in order to be saved.

The Greek translation told us in Mat 5:33-34 (above) not to swear. In Hebrew Matthew Yeshua says in that same vs. “you must not swear by anything falsely.” When He says “Let your yes be yes and your no be no” in Mat 5:37 Yeshua is saying if you swear an oath it had better be the truth! Yeshua is not changing , He is bringing out the underlying principle that you should swear truthfully!

Unfortunately this error is echoed in James 5:12, for which we have no original Hebrew text. While this could shed some doubt on the meaning of the Hebrew Mat 5:37, I believe the Hebrew text to be correct. This would mean that the Greek James 5 is wrong as well, because the words of Yeshua are necessarily true; also He cannot contradict Himself in either the NT or the TNK, which the Greek translation of James 5 (probably originally written by inspiration in Hebrew), clearly does.

Yeshua nor the Ruach HaChodesh ever did nor could change anything from the , nor indeed the entire TNK; nor could they contradict anything in the B'rit Chadasha. Genesis to Revelation, the Bible is one book with one unified and inerrant message! But only in its original form, which man has often intentionally and sometimes unintentionally perverted. However, the Word is powerful, and the truth is there for us to see, even after the centuries of evil from Constantine through the Roman church's domination, and all the attempts to change the Word of God to suit evil men!

Dan C

I think this has to do with your hearts intention of the oath and swearing in the first place. I could be wrong but I personally think the verses in that passage of Mattityahu are saying that he would rather you not swear than lie to yourselves and not follow through. "Let your Yes be a simple yes and your no a simple no." If you swear or make an oath to the Father keep it don't play in the middle and choose when you keep the oath and when you don't, let it be a simple yes or no response. I think it might be connected also when he talked about it here in the Vision to Yochanan,
Revelation 3:15
15 “I know what you are doing: you are neither cold nor hot. How I wish you were either one or the other!
Also in Hoshea,
Hoshea 10:2
2 Their heart is divided;
now they will bear their guilt.
He will break down their altars
and destroy their standing-stones.

[alon]

Sept 7, 2013 18:21:59 GMT -8 Yedidyah said:

Sept 7, 2013 12:30:02 GMT -8 alon said:

Jer 12:16 “Then, if they will carefully learn my people's ways, swearing by my name, 'As YHVH lives,' ..., they will be built up among my people.” This is one of the few places in the TNK it speaks directly to gentiles.It says we must learn to swear “As YHVH lives!” in order to be saved.

The Greek translation told us in Mat 5:33-34 (above) not to swear. In Hebrew Matthew Yeshua says in that same vs. “you must not swear by anything falsely.” When He says “Let your yes be yes and your no be no” in Mat 5:37 Yeshua is saying if you swear an oath it had better be the truth! Yeshua is not changing , He is bringing out the underlying principle that you should swear truthfully!
Dan C

I think this has to do with your hearts intention of the oath and swearing in the first place. I could be wrong but I personally think the verses in that passage of Mattityahu are saying that he would rather you not swear than lie to yourselves and not follow through. "Let your Yes be a simple yes and your no a simple no." If you swear or make an oath to the Father keep it don't play in the middle and choose when you keep the oath and when you don't, let it be a simple yes or no response. I think it might be connected also when he talked about it here in the Vision to Yochanan,
Revelation 3:15
15 “I know what you are doing: you are neither cold nor hot. How I wish you were either one or the other!
Also in Hoshea,
Hoshea 10:2
2 Their heart is divided;
now they will bear their guilt.
He will break down their altars
and destroy their standing-stones.

That is certainly a large part of it. Look at the part I highlighted in maroon especially in relation to what you said. Does that not look prophetic? What is the main thing all Christianity (including Messianics) must profess as absolutely true? That Yeshua LIVES! And we can't equivocate on that point! Did He rise from the dead? YES! Does death have any hold on Him? NO!

As YHVH lives, I swear and believe that is true.

Dan C

[Yedidyah]

Amen to that Dan!