Nice!

[messianicmama]

Glad to find this here! I like to check out everything out there when I study, so I bought a copy of the Zohar. It's interesting. Out there in places, confusing sometimes, enlightening occasionally. I enjoy it. I'm not into all the weird new age, Hollywood junk, but the midrashes are interesting. Any thoughts?

[alon]

Mar 20, 2013 22:11:37 GMT -8 messianicmama said:

Glad to find this here! I like to check out everything out there when I study, so I bought a copy of the Zohar. It's interesting. Out there in places, confusing sometimes, enlightening occasionally. I enjoy it. I'm not into all the weird new age, Hollywood junk, but the midrashes are interesting. Any thoughts?

Well, I think you are more courageous than I am, for starters. The little I've seen of it is daunting, as I have to budget my study efforts. Ad frankly, I'm too much like an old hound- too easily distracted by another rabbit trail. But any gems you find there I'll gladly look at! I wish you luck!

Dan C

[kip]

Mar 20, 2013 22:11:37 GMT -8 messianicmama said:

Glad to find this here! I like to check out everything out there when I study, so I bought a copy of the Zohar. It's interesting. Out there in places, confusing sometimes, enlightening occasionally. I enjoy it. I'm not into all the weird new age, Hollywood junk, but the midrashes are interesting. Any thoughts?

Be extremely careful with this subject and study. Mysticism is alluring and is something people tend to look into out of curiosity. It can lead to problems and in some extreme cases demonic attack. It is never wise to mess around with spirits, forces, or things we may perceive as good and delve into it only to find out later it has caused problems or self destruction. There is a reason why rabbis have discussed and even made laws about the Kaballah. If you are not able to discern the spirits or powers you know nothing of you can open yourself up to the demonic. If you want to learn how one can be deceived through thoughts of supposed angelic or holy entities look up John Dee (13 July 1527–1608) He messed around with powers he thought were angelic or godly in power but they were demonic and lied to him, promising him powerful knowledge and even gave him what we know now of as enochian language and script, symbols and tongue. This is evil in nature and not of G-d. Angels do not have relationships with humans as we do each other they are only messengers from G-d and are not interested in conversing with or having friendships with us as it is forbidden by G-d (just research the book of Enoch and read about the Watchers and their downfall) Angels focus on worshiping G-d and doing his will. The only time a Angel will be permitted to be on earth to witness in the flesh to people is spoken of in the Revelations.

Through my walk in life i have seen many things, and have come to know a lot of things before i met Christ. And one thing i can say is be ever careful in what you look into. The Holy Spirit will tell you if you ask of it if what you are reading, learning, following is right or wrong. I thank G-d everyday for showing me the proper way and changing my life around, now i use what i know as a warning to others, to help them stay on the narrow path, and what can make one fall off and go to the wide path. Believe me Hasatan has many tricks and many ways to deceive. The other scary thing most people forget is that just because we are saved does NOT prevent a attack nor a curse on us from the demonic. Just read 1st Peter 5:8-9 and Jude 1:8-10. We are protected but can come under attack if we stray or allow Hasatan a doorway into ourselves. This is why i spend most of my time learning and understanding in order to help those that want to understand why bad things happen in their lives when they feel they are ok and safe and living G-ds word yet things happen that are bad and we never know why. Fact is there is always a reason and that is why i do what i do, i learn and understand and through G-ds advice i give it out to those to help them right the wrong they may have made either it be something you did you didnt think was wrong but may have been a sin against G-d.

Example: IN your home do you have things that may be idols to demonic gods? such as a souvenir you bought overseas? did you go to hawaii and have a lai put on your neck? did you ever visit the dome of the rock and remove your shoes? If you did you allowed homage to the demonic and they have a claim on you unless you renounce it in His Holy Name. The attacks can range from illness to poverty.

This is why i feel G-d has brought me about face and made me realize the errors in my ways, through that i can now use my skills to help those that need help and can answer questions that most never can get answered. I am here because G-d gave me a gift to help people in need and to help people from falling prey to false doctrines and demonic natures. It is not me in general but the Holy Spirit through me.

[messianicmama]

Have you read any of the Zohar? It's basically commentary On the parashot with a mystical twist. It's not voodoo. A lot of what is floating around Hollywood is crazy, but the Zohar is no more crazy than any other manmade commentary. I take what supports my understanding of Yeshua's interpretation of . Anything else? I just smile, and turn the page. I think Christians could benefit from expanding their horizons in the study department. We've been force-fed so much propaganda, that we don't know how to think. After being Messianic for 10 years now and totally overhauling my whole life, I feel very secure in my abilities to read and discern. In fact, if I didn't read I wouldn't be as strong in my walk as I am. I understand your caution- and appreciate it- but I think for seasoned believers, we need to move beyond the simple stuff and really dig!

[kip]

Mar 27, 2013 21:22:33 GMT -8 messianicmama said:

Have you read any of the Zohar? It's basically commentary On the parashot with a mystical twist. It's not voodoo. A lot of what is floating around Hollywood is crazy, but the Zohar is no more crazy than any other manmade commentary. I take what supports my understanding of Yeshua's interpretation of . Anything else? I just smile, and turn the page. I think Christians could benefit from expanding their horizons in the study department. We've been force-fed so much propaganda, that we don't know how to think. After being Messianic for 10 years now and totally overhauling my whole life, I feel very secure in my abilities to read and discern. In fact, if I didn't read I wouldn't be as strong in my walk as I am. I understand your caution- and appreciate it- but I think for seasoned believers, we need to move beyond the simple stuff and really dig!

I could'nt agree with you more! I am glad you said that, Christians do need to expand in the study. What i was referring to was the problem of most peoples preconception of spirituality. It is what i refer to as meat (heavy study) whereas most young or new Christians need to focus on milk which is the Bible.

The Zohar is a collection of commentaries on the , intended to guide people who have already achieved high spiritual degrees to the root (origin) of their souls.

The Zohar contains all the spiritual states that people experience as their souls evolve. At the end of the process, the souls achieve what Kabbalah refers to as “the end of correction,” the highest level of spiritual wholeness.

To those without spiritual attainment, The Zohar reads like a collection of allegories and legends that can be interpreted and perceived differently by each individual. But to those with spiritual attainment, i.e. Kabbalists, The Zohar is a practical guide to inner actions that one performs in order to discover deeper, higher states of perception and sensation.

The Zohar was written for people who have already achieved spiritual perception. It contains the depictions of Rabbi Shimon Bar Yochai (Rashbi), who attained all 125 degrees of the spiritual ladder of degrees. Rashbi expressed the entire spiritual path and titled it Zohar (“radiance” in Hebrew).

The Zohar is built so that only those who achieve a certain spiritual level can benefit from what they read in it. Prior to studying The Zohar, one needs to study other texts that teach how to properly approach the text in The Zohar.

The Zohar was kept hidden for 900 years, between the 2nd and the 11th centuries CE, since those who possessed its wisdom understood that at the time, people did not need it and would misunderstand its contents.

Only in the 16th century CE did a Kabbalist arise who explained the fundamentals of Kabbalah - The Holy Ari, Rabbi Isaac Luria (1534-1572). The Ari stated that from his time on, the wisdom of Kabbalah was ready to be opened to everyone.

The Zohar cannot be understood and felt directly, but requires preconception of spirituality, before one approaches the book. The greatest Kabbalist of our time-Rabbi Yehuda Ashlag (Baal HaSulam)-wrote introductions to The Zohar precisely to guide one’s approach to this profound book prior to studying it.

Such articles cultivate one’s spiritual qualities to perceive the Higher reality. Additionally, these texts provide knowledge of how to approach certain terms, phrases, and concepts in The Zohar, to maximize its use as a guide for spiritual attainment, avoiding being lost in materialized depictions that the human mind is prone to form.

[messianicmama]

[Yedidyah]

kip you wrote,
"It is what i refer to as meat (heavy study) whereas most young or new Christians need to focus on milk which is the Bible." !


I would be cautious to give anything a higher credit than the bible. The is given through the bible and to place any other book as being higher is a doctrine I don't want to see here.
The has some meat to it and to compare the bible as milk and the Zohar as meat just about pushes the border of allowance. So keep the conversation kosher and be careful not to belittle the Word.

[messianicmama]

Not belittling the Word. I was referring to the mindset that believers should only study Christian approved literature. And commentaries are incredibly useful in not only learning about but in just being prompted to think in a different way. Challenging what we know will help us to digg deeper and learn more.

[R' Y'hoshua Moshe]

B"H

Shalom,

Messianicmama, I think Yedidyah was speaking about Kip's comment, and not yours. I agree that there is a lot of misunderstanding on this subject. But, one thing is for sure, the Zohar is a commentary on the weekly portion, of a highly spiritual nature...and not the Satanic bible. It is not the , nor is it the word of God. I would also be cautious in referring to the Zohar as meat...perhaps commentary on the meat, which is the , N'vi'im, and Ketuvim, but not the meat itself...Maybe some seasoning?

That which is called "kabbalah" should be taken on a case by case basis, and we should certainly strike it down if it contradicts the TeNaKh. That is what this part of the forum is for...to compare that which is called "kabbalah" to the word of God to see if it withstands the test. I think we should do this with any traditional Jewish text.

One thing is for sure...if we haven't yet read the entire Bible at least seven times over, and have really studied it, if we haven't become proficient in learning Biblical Hebrew, ect...than we really have no business spending much time exploring the commentary in the Zohar or other kabbalistic works. We have to prioritize our time and what we are learning...and the Zohar and other similar traditional Jewish texts should be low on our priority list of texts to study.

If our study priorities are out of line I recommend re-investing any time spent looking into kabbalistic literature and spend it diligently studying the TeNaKh, learning Biblical Hebrew, ect...just for starters. After someone has spent time gaining scholarship in these areas there are many other subjects that one should be well-studied in before they spend any substantial time learning about the subject in question, such as learning Biblical history, world history, Jewish history, Mishnah, Talmud, ect.

Shalom b'Yeshua,

R' Reuel

[messianicmama]

Seasoning... Lol

I agree. I enjoy reading most commentaries on the just to see what's out there. I've definitely read done interesting things in the Zohar, but also a lot that was questionable. No different than any other commentary I read!

[Yedidyah]

Apr 9, 2013 15:54:02 GMT -8 messianicmama said:

Seasoning... Lol

I agree. I enjoy reading most commentaries on the just to see what's out there. I've definitely read done interesting things in the Zohar, but also a lot that was questionable. No different than any other commentary I read!

I think that is good to always question any commentary. And like R' Reuel said it was not directed at your comment at all. Thanks for your input

Shalom!

[alon]

I feel compelled to place a warning about the "truths" found in Zohar and Kabbalah whenever I see such a topic: theloveofgod.proboards.com/thread/5198/zohar