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Post by Mark on Dec 29, 2009 5:11:50 GMT -8
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Post by Dogface Of Judah on Dec 29, 2009 20:02:31 GMT -8
Shalom to all. My name is Shlomo Riskin. I am the Chief rabbi of the City of Efrat…..I am an Orthodox Rabbi…and an Orthodox Rabbi who is very profoundly interested in religion in general, in Christianity, and especially in the persona of Jesus in particular….I was truly fascinated by the personality of Jesus, whom to myself I have always referred to as “Rabbi Jesus”….because I think he is indeed a “model Rabbi” in many counts…and he lived the life of a Jewish Rabbi in Israel in a very critical time in our history….. I have constantly come back to the study of his personality and his teachings which are very strongly rooted in Talmudic teachings…..”   |
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Post by zionlion on Dec 29, 2009 21:40:19 GMT -8
Rabbi Riskin is on dangerous ground.
He's walking very close to the truth.
Let's pray for him.
If he will spend less time in the Talmud and more in the Tanach and Brit Chadashah, and seek the guidance of the Ruach, he may find real understanding in the teachings of "rabbi Yeshua".
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Post by Mark on Dec 30, 2009 4:40:54 GMT -8
If you've ever read Matthew Henry or Josephus or Saint Augustine, you know that there is a lot of really, really good, powerful and meaningful theology mixed in with a splattering of absolute houey. Talmud is the same as any commentary of men who are intently and passionately focused on studying and understanding the Word of God from a human perspective. Elsewhere in this forum, I've made some effort to demonstrate that Yeshua can be validated as Messiah, or the His definitive characteristics at least verified, in the Talmud.
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Post by zionlion on Dec 30, 2009 8:16:25 GMT -8
Commentaries can be useful if kept in proper perspective. History shows that Talmud is more effective at keeping people away from Yeshua than it is at leading them to Him.
Let's pray for this man.
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Post by Mark on Dec 31, 2009 4:41:21 GMT -8
It's really quite an uncomfortable paradox. Most of the teachings of commentators that support our understanding of Messiah Yeshua do so from a perspective that is indifferent (at best) to the commandments of  . Those who have spent their lives embracing and trying to understand the depth and magnitude of , teaching personal observance to their disciples, are recorded for us in Talmud. Isaiah 8:20 says, "To the Law and to the Testimonies, if they speak not according to this word there is no light in them." Who should we believe? |
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Post by zionlion on Dec 31, 2009 19:10:06 GMT -8
That's so true.
Is it because the truth has been covered over by centuries of false teaching on both sides?
The blind leading the blind?
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Post by zionlion on Jan 5, 2010 15:34:13 GMT -8
If rabbi Riskin was misrepresented, that is unacceptable.
To say that any Jew who believes in Yeshua is "not a Jew and loses all of his Jewish privileges" is also unacceptable. I'm glad Zola Levitt is not here to see that.
This rabbi has smicha (?). He should know better.
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tonga
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Post by tonga on Jan 5, 2010 16:12:09 GMT -8
If rabbi Riskin was misrepresented, that is unacceptable. To say that any Jew who believes in Yeshua is "not a Jew and loses all of his Jewish privileges" is also unacceptable. I'm glad Zola Levitt is not here to see that. This rabbi has smicha (?). He should know better. A Jew who believes in Jesus is still a Jew, and R' Riskin knows that. I think he is implying more along the line of him having been cut off from his people. However, it is generally true that a Jew who converts to another faith does lose their privileges as a Jew...no aliyah in shul (and to Israel), no counting as a minyon, no Jewish burial...but if a Jew has adopted another faith, I don't know why they would wish those priviledges anyway. Yes, R' Riskin has Orthodox smicha and is well regarded. |
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Post by zionlion on Jan 5, 2010 16:50:53 GMT -8
To be honest, the believing Jew understands that it is better to be cut off by unbelieving Jews than to be cut off by the Elohim of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.
Rabbi Riskin doesn't need to convert to anything.
He simply needs, like all of us, to have atonement for his sins.
Smicha, though admirable, is no replacement for atonement.
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Post by zionlion on Jan 5, 2010 18:02:39 GMT -8
Too bad we don't have a chat room.  I have to repeat; a believing Jew doesn't "convert". He/she simply believes what the Tanach teaches about covenant and atonement. Why do you think he has atonement? Where is his atonement? |
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Post by Mark on Jan 6, 2010 4:58:01 GMT -8
Thank you, Tonga, for the clarification and the correction. I will pass on the link to the clarification to the source that I got the original. If I were able to extend my disappointment and condolense to Rabbi Riskin for being misrepresnted in this way, I would certainly do my best. It is unconscionable that the people who believe in the Lord God of all creation would resort to manipulation and deceit in order to promote their faith. It is taking Adonai's name to the extremes of vanity and worthlessness in idolatry.
Thank you.
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tonga
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Post by tonga on Jan 6, 2010 10:28:46 GMT -8
Thank you, Tonga, for the clarification and the correction. I will pass on the link to the clarification to the source that I got the original. If I were able to extend my disappointment and condolense to Rabbi Riskin for being misrepresnted in this way, I would certainly do my best. It is unconscionable that the people who believe in the Lord God of all creation would resort to manipulation and deceit in order to promote their faith. It is taking Adonai's name to the extremes of vanity and worthlessness in idolatry. Thank you Mark, I agree. I originally got the video link in my email from someone who couldn't figure out why R' Riskin would make such a video. I saw it and believed the video and was upset that he would make such statements. I did not judge favorably, although I did wonder who he made the video for. I think his explanation is excellent and I hope this whole event does not interfere with his attempts to dialogue with Christians. |
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Post by zionlion on Jan 9, 2010 20:38:26 GMT -8
I was disappointed to see that rabbi Riskin is not where I thought he was. Let's keep praying for him. The grip of religious tradition is strong, enabled by the powers of darkness in high places, doing everything in their power to separate Elohim from His people, knowing what the end result will be if that separation is successful.
It's getting late. The time for religiosity is over for both Jew and gentile. If we really believe that G-d exists and that the Bible is His Word, let's learn it and live it. Let's earnestly seek the Ruach to show us the truth. Let's identify false teachers and rebuke them. Let's stop following men who create their own truth.
I follow Paul. I follow Simeon Peter. I follow this rabbi. I follow that rabbi. This rabbi says Yeshua is the Messiah. That rabbi says Yeshua isn't the Messiah. What is truth? Does truth matter? Can I accept the truth? Will I accept the truth?
Where can I find the truth? I think we know the answer to that one.
Sorry, just had to vent.
Have a great week, everyone.
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Post by Chizuk Emunah on Jan 21, 2010 21:16:58 GMT -8
Too bad we don't have a chat room. I have to repeat; a believing Jew doesn't "convert". He/she simply believes what the Tanach teaches about covenant and atonement. Why do you think he has atonement? Where is his atonement? Shouldn't this be discussed in another thread? The response could get quite lengthy. If you'd like to create one, I would be happy to respond to your questions. |
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and one ordinance for you and for the alien who sojourns with you. [Numbers 15:16]
