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Post by azgdt5120 on Dec 4, 2009 19:32:03 GMT -8
when the true worshipers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him
Is this a prophesy who speaks about the future children of YHWH worshiping everywhere until the restoration of the new Jerusalem? Was Adonai speaking about all those who will surrender to his feet as the Messiah, the son of God?
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Post by azgdt5120 on Apr 9, 2010 9:30:06 GMT -8
Shalom Mark, According to your thread above, "Messiah must reconcile between Jew and Gentiles," I have got a question for you. If you do believe the opening statement to this thread of yours, how do your explain the fact that every time Yeshua would send his disciples on a mission to take the good news about God's Kingdom, he would warn his disciples not to visit pagan territories or even enter a Samaritan town? (Mat. 10:5) How do you expect a reconciliation between Jews and Gentiles if he would not allow Gentiles to share in the bountious blessings he had brought to the Jews? If the change occurred with the crucifixion, which probably is what you will tell me, who effected that change, Paul? Ben As any other  reading and interpretation ( based on Talmud or Mishna or taking a Chazal such as Rashi in consideration), a carefull reading of every Berit Hadashah passage must be done in the context it is narrated. If one reviews that passage carefully and read above in verse 9:36, Yeshua described the personal and spiritual condition of many jews he was sorrounded by . This is the panoramic that must come to mind when reading 10:5 Restoration was offered in that specific chronological time to the opressed jews to make teshuvah and return to the judaism teached by Esdra( since there was unlist 4 different types of judaism recognized in that time, Essenes, Parushim, Sadukim, and Kumran) That teaching does not leaves out goyim, since there was later Devarim for teshuvah and yesha to the goy as recorded in future passages. |
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Post by yiska on Mar 9, 2013 7:33:29 GMT -8
This is very interesting. I thought that the gentiles and the Jews were to be reconcile again once the third temple was rebuilt again. I don't think that necessary mean the third temple will be built but of people who Pray for the peace of Jerusalem?
;D
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Post by alon on Mar 9, 2013 12:16:56 GMT -8
This is very interesting. I thought that the gentiles and the Jews were to be reconcile again once the third temple was rebuilt again. I don't think that necessary mean the third temple will be built but of people who Pray for the peace of Jerusalem? ;D Believers are reconciled now, Jew and gentile. The word went to the gentiles specifically after Peter's infamouse dream- you know, Acts 10, the one where the mainstream folks like to throw bacon at us ... . An evangelist for Chosen People Ministries once told me that to "pray for the peace of Jerusalem" is to pray for the return of ha Moshiac, since that day will never come until Yisra'el has cried "Abba Father!" and His feet rest on the Mount in Yerusalim itself. So whenever I pray this, I always add a prayer that unsaved loved ones will come to know Him before that time. Dan C |
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Post by yiska on Mar 9, 2013 12:32:25 GMT -8
bacon? BLAH!  Anywho.... I thought it was the Gentiles to help the Jewish people to see that the Messiah has already came, will come again the second coming and that we must help them open their eyes through prayer? I have seen on youtube that the Jewish people do not want to change.. How much of this is true and will we be replaced as the chosen people of Messiah's coming? |
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Post by alon on Mar 9, 2013 13:20:21 GMT -8
... Anywho.... I thought it was the Gentiles to help the Jewish people to see that the Messiah has already came, will come again the second coming and that we must help them open their eyes through prayer? That is part of our calling, for sure. I have a heart for Jewish people, so I'd not disagree- in fact I'd say it is our responsibility to be a witness to them and to support Jewish missions. There is a LOT of resistance, based in their strong identity as Jews (even those who do not practice their faith) and their lifetime of being told we hate them and those who accept Yeshua are traitors. Sadly this is based in historical fact. From Constantine to Hitler they have been severely persecuted in the name of a Christ that looks and sounds more like an angry pagan than a observant Jew. Even today anti-Semitism is rampant in our churches. Sometimes it is almost comical- one friend, knowing my wife was Jewish, asked her "But aren't we SUPPOSED to hate the Jews?" Most of the time it is deadly serious as when mainline denominations such as the United Methodists officially denouncing Israel, although thank God they couldn't force their constituents into voting for sanctions. It is in our every day speech as well. Many times I hear terms like "Jew them down" thrown out with no thought. And Displacement Theology is so ingrained we do not even notice it. To answer your question about replacement, no, God never revokes a calling and He never breaks a covenant. We all have our roles in His plan, and no one will be replaced. We are however made heirs to the promise through adoption, praise God! But we are grafted onto THEIR family tree. A graft does not replace the root that feeds it, nor can the trunk replace the graft that is supported by it. Dan C |
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Post by R' Y'hoshua Moshe on Mar 13, 2013 16:38:27 GMT -8
The TeNaKh and the Apostolic scriptures (Romans 11) are clear that the Jewish people will never be replaced...in fact the scriptures teach us that the people of Yisra'el will be saved and will be the ruling nations over all other nations. In Messiah Yeshua, both Jew and those from the nations have been reconciled into one new man (Ephesians 2).
It should also be noted that although many Jews still don't belive that Yeshua is the Messiah...more Jews in this century have come to faith in Messiah Yeshua than in any other century. This is only increasing as we get closer to the coming of HaMashiach.
Shalom b'Yeshua,
R' Reuel
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Post by yiska on Mar 14, 2013 7:16:05 GMT -8
The TeNaKh and the Apostolic scriptures (Romans 11) are clear that the Jewish people will never be replaced...in fact the scriptures teach us that the people of Yisra'el will be saved and will be the ruling nations over all other nations. In Messiah Yeshua, both Jew and those from the nations have been reconciled into one new man (Ephesians 2). It should also be noted that although many Jews still don't belive that Yeshua is the Messiah...more Jews in this century have come to faith in Messiah Yeshua than in any other century. This is only increasing as we get closer to the coming of HaMashiach. Shalom b'Yeshua, R' Reuel Thank you for explaining. The last paragraph helped me see it better.  |
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chazz
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Post by chazz on May 9, 2013 6:02:16 GMT -8
I think that many many jews are straddling the fence, and are afraid to let go of Moses, all through the Old testament the prophets talk about the jews and Israelites returning, and I believe that the israelites are the 10 lost tribes, and their blood is heavily mixed with the european races.
Also the Ill's that have fell on the jewish and israelite peoples are trials by fire as told by God through the prophets, After leaving egypt with Moses It did not take them long to seek other gods, and they have taken many long steps away from God, and now nearer the end times they are slowly starting to seek and find the truth about Jesus.
I believe that our troubles are not about race or nationalities but Souls. we must remember that there was a war in heaven and lucifer [satan] was cast out with his followers, and God created Adam, as a new race of people,
It just may be his plan to return those lost souls back to him, and eventualiy God Chose Abraham to be his vehicle to bring about the return of those lost souls, from his line came Jacob and God changed his name to Israel, he had 12 sons that started their tribes, that became the nation known as Israelites, 10 of those tribes are lost, leaving 2 which are Known as Jews.
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reading and interpretation ( based on Talmud or Mishna or taking a Chazal such as Rashi in consideration), a carefull reading of every Berit Hadashah passage must be done in the context it is narrated. If one reviews that passage carefully and read above in verse 9:36, Yeshua described the personal and spiritual condition of many jews he was sorrounded by . This is the panoramic that must come to mind when reading 10:5
