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Post by alon on Sept 11, 2014 4:56:49 GMT -8
NOTE see corrected copy at bottom.
I rewrote with the suggestions given. The rewrite is at the bottom, a few posts down.
Dan C
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Post by Questor on Sept 11, 2014 23:49:57 GMT -8
This too is going to be given as part of a witness, where someone asked about church history. So as always, any corrections or additions would be greatly appreciated.
Dan C
"Natsarim are suppressed as heretics and accused of perversion for obeying  . The “church fathers” and now the modern Christian churches interpreted the New Testament as they wanted, then made the Old agree and declared what they couldn’t or didn’t like “fulfilled”; to them done away with. Everything was and is “New”, and “led by the Spirit” they can justify anything! I call this the “Do whatever my sinful li’ll ole’ heart desires” doctrine.
It is necessary to acknowledge that the Ruach haKodesh does lead some people into the ...and into lawful ways, even as those who seek YHVH seek Him with their whole hearts. For thus were you led, and I as well.
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Post by alon on Sept 12, 2014 7:48:53 GMT -8
How's that?
Dan
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Post by Questor on Sept 13, 2014 15:47:13 GMT -8
With my additions, very nice! 
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Post by Questor on Sept 13, 2014 15:54:40 GMT -8
Sept 11, 2014 5:57:25 GMT -7 alon said:
Evidence the Natsarim Sect existed in opposition to this thinking until the 13th cen CE is found in the writings of Bonacursus, entitled “Against the Heretics”. He refers to “Nazarenes”, also called 'Pasagini':
“Let those who are not yet acquainted with them, please note how perverse their belief and doctrine are. First, they teach that we should obey the Law of Moses according to the letter - the Sabbath, and circumcision, and the legal precepts still being in force. Furthermore, to increase their error, they condemn and reject all the Church Fathers, and the whole Roman Church."
It is possible YHVH preserved a remnant (observing in an underground manner throughout the last two millenia), however the Messianic, or Natsarim movement did not start in force again until around the 1960’s and 70’s. And it is gaining strength worldwide. My own synagogue is starting at least one, maybe two new synagogues in the Seattle area and another in Brazil within just the last two months!
Sadly, it has not always been so. The Greco-Roman mindset has been failing to understand the foundation of the faith because they approach the Scriptures from a Gentile (non-Covenant) point of view, where Gentiles remain Gentiles after coming to a belief in Yeshua. This is erroneous, since there is but one body, not two or three. Gentiles must engraft (Rom. 11) into Israel, Israelites do not engraft into a Gentile "church". Besides all this,(you must realize that the very word "church") the word "church" is derived from a Pagan deity, Circe.
The “church fathers” were mostly trained at the Catechetical School of Alexandria, Egypt; founded circa 190 CE. Origen taught there and succeeded Clement as head of the school. (As an example, Origen was)He was self-castrated and a vegetarian, as many others of his time and faith. He wasn’t even born until (nearly 200 AD) the late 2nd cen CE. Tertulian and Irenaeus were Origen's contemporaries.
They developed what later became Christianity, and then Roman “Universalism”, or Catholicism. All were pagans, and many were sun-worshippers who adopted a belief in the Messiah of Yisra’el. They worked predominantly with Greek texts, many writing their own versions (the New Testament is pieced together from over 5000 Greek documents, many if not most of which disagree in some respects to each other, according to Moody Bible Institute). From their own letters, we see they despised the Natsarim. The church fathers suppressed the Hebrew roots of the faith, developing pagan Greek roots instead.
There were two common traits among all the church fathers: condemnation of the Natsarim, and rabid anti-Semitism. They retained their identity as Gentiles, saying they don’t keep “Jewish” rules. However YHVH gave us laws long before there ever was a Jew. If Adam had no law, he couldn’t have sinned. And YHVH, (G-d, whether) as Adonai nor Yeshua (N)ever changed any laws. Men do that.
Seminaries today promote teachings of these “church fathers”, (who actually were) men who persecuted and murdered countless Jews and Natsarim. If they have any connection at all to the 1st cen CE, they are the spiritual descendants of those who hated Rav Sha’ul (Rabbi Paul): “But we desire to hear from you what your views are, for with regard to this sect we know that everywhere it is spoken against." Acts 28:22
The reason we’ve (the Natsarim) always been despised is simple. Earth is under the influence of ha satan since Adam & Chavah forfeited YHVH’s sovereignty over Earth. Obeying Commandments, and possessing the witness of Yeshua, are not what the church fathers did; and they weren’t about to allow anyone else to do so. 4th cen I (in the late 300's AD the so-called) church father Jerome described the Natsarim as
“those who accept Messiah in such a way that they do not cease to observe the Old Law.”
He did not mean this kindly.
That “Old Law” is , (the commandments written in the Scriptures and described in the Oral Law and Israeli traditions up until Yeshua's death, carefully) guarded by the Natsarim. The dragon of Rev 12 pursues the offspring (Natsarim) of the Woman (Yisra’el) through constant persecutions due to doctrinal competition for control. By their own writings we see that they (the Church Fathers coexisted with, but were never a part of the Natsarim for about 300 years after Yehsua's death, the same Natsarim of which Rav Sha'ul was said to be a ringleader.) coexisted with but never were a part of the Natsarim for @ 1300 yrs. The same Natsarim of which Rav Sha’ul was said to be a ringleader.
Natsarim are suppressed as heretics and accused of perversion for obeying . The “church fathers”, (which mostly date from after AD 70 to the council of Nicea in 325 AD Under Emperor Constantine.) and now the modern Christian churches interpret the New Testament as they want, then (create the appearance of the Old testament agreeing by quoting it out of context) make the Old agree; declaring what can't agree or parts they don't like (as being) “fulfilled”; (and thus) to them done away with. Everything was and is “New”, and “led by the Spirit” (, and by using that phrasing) they can justify anything! I call this the “Do whatever my sinful li’ll ole’ heart desires” doctrine.
[/font] Yirmeyahu (Jer) 17: 9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately sick; who can understand it?The teachings hatched at the Catechetical School of Alexandria persist in every modern seminary today. The apostasy (falling-away from ) became institutionalized, and men’s traditions were set up to conceal their pagan origins.
Howevr the Ruach HaChodesh, the Spirit od Elohim, does call some into Observance, to worship Adonai as He commanded. Obeying produces love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control; this tree will not be cut down! The lawless tree that is against the Covenant will be. When you are called, onto which tree will you choose to be grafted?[/quote] How's that?
Dan[/quote] [/p] |
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Post by alon on Sept 13, 2014 19:36:55 GMT -8
Thanks for the suggestions. I'm thinking the whole thing needs a wrerite, so I may use some of them!
Dan C
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Post by alon on Sept 14, 2014 0:16:21 GMT -8
Church History- Natsarim vs. Christianity
The Natsarim (commonly misspelled Nazarines) are a sect named for followers of Yeshua of Natsarith; Gevurot (Ma’asei) 24:5 (Orthodox Jewish Bible, OJB) "For having found this man a troublemaker and an inciter of riots among all the Yehudim throughout kol ha’aretz, a manhig of the kat [of Judaism], the Natzrati Kat.” (Natsarim sect)
Yeshua is the true Name of Israel's Mashiach, undefiled by pagan Greek. "Natsarim" literally translates as watchmen, guardians, protectors; also connotes searchers, or seekers of the Way. We are truly grafted with the Hebrew rootstalk. We live in the whole Word, the teachings that bring nourishment from the root of Messianic Judaism. This nourishment is , which the "Living Word", Yeshua HaMoshiach, gave to us through Moshe (Moses) and the prophets.
Our enemy, ha satan, has always hated Yisra’el- a sentiment present in far too many churches as it was extremely reflected in all the “church fathers.” He has manipulated and structured our religions to promote a culture of rebellion.
Never have the Natsarim and the church existed as one entity. Even before there was a church father, or for that matter a “church” as it is meant today, Tertullus, a hired accuser of Rav Sha’ul, said to Felix “For we have found this man a plague, one who stirs up riots among all the Jews throughout the world and is a ringleader of the sect of the Nazarenes.” Act 24:5.
We keep the Feasts of the Lord which reflect the redemption plan for Israel, and therefore for all men. All the nations of the Earth are invited to “engraft” into the commonwealth of Israel through the Covenant (Eph. 2:8-13). However the “spin” put upon obeying the Covenant is very deceptive, calling it “legalism.” If we are “legal” following , then we’re truly of Israel. Conversely it could be said those not following are practicing “illegalism.” Yeshua and His disciples were observant Jews. We cannot claim to follow Yeshua and not follow . To not follow is to follow the lawless one; 2 Thes 2:8-9 “And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will kill with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming. The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with all power and false signs and wonders”.
Of course we do not actually practice legalism. Legalism is really the false belief one can be saved by keeping the law. We never preach this! We are saved by grace through faith, the same as the Jews were and their fathers before them. Romayim (Romans) 4:3 For what does the Scripture say? "Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness." But after salvation we should want to keep God’s laws in obedience to Him so that we may live a holy (set apart) and happy life. Three times James said “faith without works is dead” (vv 2:17, 20, 26).
The early church fathers were all Greek or Roman and so heavily schooled in paganism: Clement of Rome, Ignatius of Antioch and Polycarp of Smyrna, Irenaeus of Lyons, Clement of Alexandria, Athanasius of Alexandria, John Chrysostom, Cyril of Alexandria, the Cappadocian Fathers (Basil of Caesarea, Gregory Nazianzus, Peter of Sebaste, Gregory of Nyssa), Maximus the Confessor, and John of Damascus, Augustine, Tertullian, Jerome, Epiphanius.
The “church” claims Clement of Rome was anointed by “Saint Peter” to lead them, and this is their claim to “Apostolic Succession.” I’ve stepped in stuff that smells better than this claim, as all we have is Catholic tradition to back it up. There is no evidence for Clement to have ever gone to a synagogue, Messianic or otherwise, nor that he ever was trained by any of the very Jewish apostles. I would have to say this claim is an outright lie.
D’varim (Deut) 12:30-32 take care that you be not ensnared to follow them, after they have been destroyed before you, and that you do not inquire about their gods, saying, 'How did these nations serve their gods?--that I also may do the same.' You shall not worship the LORD your God in that way, for every abominable thing that the LORD hates they have done for their gods, for they even burn their sons and their daughters in the fire to their gods "Everything that I command you, you shall be careful to do. You shall not add to it or take from it.
Do not stray from , Elohim’s instructions for holy living and in how He is to be worshiped.
Mid-2nd cen “church father” Irenaeus held that bishops provided the only safe guide to interpretation of Scripture, thus paving the way for papal primacy. Also, in the interest of unity, doctrinal authority had to be solely established by Episcopal “councils.” “Episcopal” means governed by bishops; so these ideas laid the foundation for Nicolaitanes and a hierarchical chain of command, culminating in the catholic, or “universal” Church.
A quote from Jerome affirms Natsarim existed during the 4th cen CE:
"Recently I read in a certain Hebrew book
that a Hebrew from the Natsarim sect brought to me,
the apocryphon of YirmeYahu, in which I found this text
written word for word." (Jerome; Commentary on Matthew 2:23)
Mat 2: 23 And he went and lived in a city called Nazareth, that what was spoken by the prophets might be fulfilled: "He shall be called a Nazarene."
4th cen church father Epiphanius describes the Natsarim:
“We shall now especially consider heretics who... call themselves Nazarenes; they are mainly Jews and nothing else. They make use not only of the New Testament, but they also use in a way the Old Testament of the Jews; for they do not forbid the books of the Law, the Prophets, and the Writings... so that they are approved of by the Jews, from whom the Nazarenes do not differ in anything, and they profess all the dogmas pertaining to the prescriptions of the Law and to the customs of the Jews, except they believe in Messiah. They preach that there is but one God, and His Son Yeshua the Messiah. But they are very learned in the Hebrew language; for they, like the Jews, read the whole Law, then the Prophets...They differ from the Jews because they believe in Messiah, and from the Christians in that they are to this day bound to the Jewish rites, such as circumcision, the Sabbath, and other ceremonies. They have the Good news according to Matthew in its entirety in Hebrew. For it is clear that they still preserve this, in the Hebrew alphabet, as it was originally written”.
This record shows just how arrogant Christianity had become early on. After Irenaeus, a new error was adopted, “Apostolic Succession” and the idea that “church” hierarchy could supersede any Commandment, and usurp the title “Israel” for itself. This is called Replacement Theology, and is practiced by almost every Christian church today.
Supersessionism, fulfillment theology, and replacement theology are terms used in biblical interpretation for the belief that the Christian Church supersedes or replaces Israel in God's plan, and that the so called "New Covenant" nullifies the biblical promises made to Israel, including the Abrahamic Covenant, the Land Covenant, and the Davidic Covenant. However, it has no Belief in the Mosaic Covenant (), which most Christian groups agree was always intended to be superseded and nullified by the New Covenant.
Evidence the Natsarim Sect existed in opposition to this thinking until the 13th cen CE is found in the writings of Bonacursus, entitled “Against the Heretics”. He refers to “Nazarenes”, also called 'Pasagini':
“Let those who are not yet acquainted with them, please note how perverse their belief and doctrine are. First, they teach that we should obey the Law of Moses according to the letter - the Sabbath, and circumcision, and the legal precepts still being in force. Furthermore, to increase their error, they condemn and reject all the Church Fathers, and the whole Roman Church."
It is possible YHVH preserved a remnant, worshiping “underground” or in secret, however the Messianic, or Natsarim movement did not start in force again until around the 1960’s and 70’s. And it is gaining strength worldwide. My own synagogue is starting at least one, maybe two new synagogues in the Seattle area and another in Brazil within just the last two months!
Sadly, it has not always been so. The Greco-Roman mindset has been failing to understand the foundation of the faith because they approach the Scriptures from a Gentile (non-Covenant) point of view, where Gentiles remain Gentiles after coming to a belief in Yeshua. This is erroneous, since there is but one body, not two. Gentiles must engraft (Rom. 11) into Israel, Israelites do not engraft into a Gentile "church." Besides all this, the word "church" is derived from a Pagan deity, Circe.
The “church fathers” were mostly trained at the Catechetical School of Alexandria, Egypt; founded circa 190 CE. Origen taught there and succeeded Clement as head of the school. Self-castrated and a vegetarian, as were many others of his time and faith, he wasn’t even born until the late 2nd cen CE. Tertulian and Irenaeus were contemporaries.
They were primary developers of what later became Christianity, and then Roman “Universalism,” or Catholicism. All were pagans, and many were sun-worshippers who adopted a belief in the Messiah of Yisra’el. They worked predominantly with Greek texts, many writing their own versions (the New Testament is pieced together from over 1500 Greek documents, many if not most of which disagree in some respects to each other, according to Moody Bible Institute). From their own letters, we see they despised the "Natsarim." The church fathers suppressed the Hebrew roots of the faith, developing pagan Greek roots instead.
There were two common traits among almost all the church fathers: condemnation of the Natsarim, and rabid anti-Semitism. They retained their identity as Gentiles, saying they don’t keep “Jewish” rules. However YHVH gave us laws long before there ever was a Jew. If Adam had no law, he couldn’t have sinned. And YHVH, as Adonai nor as Yeshua never changed any laws. Men did that.
Seminaries today promote teachings of these “church fathers”, men who persecuted and murdered countless Jews and Natsarim. If they have any connection at all to the believers of the 1st cen CE, they are the spiritual descendants of those who hated Rav Sha’ul (Rabbi Paul): “But we desire to hear from you what your views are, for with regard to this sect we know that everywhere it is spoken against." Acts 28:22
The reason Jews and Natsarim, those follow the commands of YHVH, have always been despised is simple. Earth is under the influence of ha satan since Adam & Chavah forfeited YHVH’s sovereignty over Earth. Obeying Commandments, and possessing the witness of Yeshua, are not what the church fathers did; and they weren’t about to allow anyone else to do so. 4th cen church father Jerome described the Natsarim as “those who accept Messiah in such a way that they do not cease to observe the Old Law.” He did not mean this kindly.
That “Old Law” is ,the commandments of Elohim, guarded by the Natsarim. The dragon of Rev 12 pursues the offspring (Natsarim) of the Woman (Yisra’el) through constant persecutions due to doctrinal competition for control. By their own writings we see that they coexisted with but never were a part of the Natsarim for @ 1400 yrs. The same Natsarim of which Rav Sha’ul was said to be a ringleader.
Yochanan the Immerser said in Luke 3:9 “Even now the axe is laid to the root of the trees. Every tree therefore that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire." The modern Christian church is sprung from a pagan tree, one whose branches do not include or for many not all of, or even any part of the TNK (Old Testament)!
Natsarim are suppressed as heretics and accused of perversion for obeying . The “church fathers”, and now modern Christian churches interpret the New Testament as they want, then create the appearance of the Old agreeing, often taking quotes out of context; declaring what they can't make agree or parts they don't like “fulfilled”; to them done away with. Everything was and is “New,” and using the phrase “led by the Spirit” they can justify anything! I call this the “Do whatever my sinful li’ll ole’ heart desires” doctrine.
Yirmeyahu (Jer) 17: 9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately sick; who can understand it?
The teachings hatched at the Catechetical School of Alexandria persist in every modern seminary today. The apostasy (falling-away from ) became institutionalized, and men’s traditions were set up to conceal their pagan origins.
Howevr the Ruach HaChodesh, the Spirit of Elohim, does call some into Observance, to worship Adonai as He commanded. Obeying produces love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control; this tree will not be cut down! The lawless tree that is against the Covenant will be. When you are called, onto which tree will you choose to be grafted?
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Post by Questor on Sept 14, 2014 1:50:33 GMT -8
Church History- Natsarim vs. Christianity
The Natsarim (commonly misspelled Nazarines) are a sect named for followers of Yeshua of Natsarith; Gevurot (Ma’asei) 24:5 (Orthodox Jewish Bible, OJB) "For having found this man a troublemaker and an inciter of riots among all the Yehudim throughout kol ha’aretz, a manhig of the kat [of Judaism], the Natzrati Kat.” (Natsarim sect)
Yeshua is the true Name of Israel's Mashiach, undefiled by pagan Greek. "Natsarim" literally translates as watchmen, guardians, protectors; also connotes searchers, or seekers of the Way. We are truly grafted with the Hebrew rootstalk. We live in the whole Word, the teachings that bring nourishment from the root of Messianic Judaism. This nourishment is , which the "Living Word", Yeshua HaMoshiach, gave to us through Moshe (Moses) and the prophets.
Our enemy, ha satan, has always hated Yisra’el- a sentiment present in far too many churches as it was extremely reflected in all the “church fathers”. He has manipulated and structured our religions to promote a culture of rebellion.
Never have the Natsarim and the church existed as one entity. Even before there was a church father, or for that matter a “church” as it is meant today, Tertullus, a hired accuser of Rav Sha’ul, said to Felix “For we have found this man a plague, one who stirs up riots among all the Jews throughout the world and is a ringleader of the sect of the Nazarenes.” Act 24:5.
We keep the Feasts of the Lord which reflect the redemption plan for Israel, and therefore for all men. All the nations of the Earth are invited to “engraft” into the commonwealth of Israel through the Covenant (Eph. 2:8-13). However the “spin” put upon obeying the Covenant is very deceptive, calling it “legalism”. If we are “legal”, following , then we’re truely of Israel. Conversely it could be said those not following are practicing “illegalism”. Yeshua and His disciples were observant Jews. We cannot claim to follow Yeshua and not follow . To not follow is to follow the lawless one; 2 Thes 2:8 “And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will kill with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with all power and false signs and wonders”.
Of course we do not actually practice legalism. Legalism is really the false belief one can be saved by keeping the law. We never preach this! We are saved by grace through faith, the same as the Jews were and their fathers before them. Romayim (Romans) 4:3 For what does the Scripture say? "Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness." But after salvation we should want to keep God’s laws in obedience to Him so that we may live a holy (set apart) and happy life. Three times James said “faith without works is dead” (vv 2:17, 20, 26).
The early church fathers were all Greek or Roman and so heavily schooled in paganism: Clement of Rome, Ignatius of Antioch and Polycarp of Smyrna, Irenaeus of Lyons, Clement of Alexandria, Athanasius of Alexandria, John Chrysostom, Cyril of Alexandria, the Cappadocian Fathers (Basil of Caesarea, Gregory Nazianzus, Peter of Sebaste, Gregory of Nyssa), Maximus the Confessor, and John of Damascus, Augustine, Tertullian, Jerome, Epiphanius.
The “church” claims Clement of Rome was anointed by “Saint Peter” to lead the chur and this is their claim to “Apostolic Succession.” I’ve stepped in stuff that smells better than this claim, as all we have is Catholic tradition to back up the claim. There is no evidence for Clement to have ever gone to a synagogue, Messianic or otherwise nor that he ever was trained by any of the very Jewish apostles. I would have to say this claim is an outright lie.
D’varim (Deut) 12:30 take care that you be not ensnared to follow them, after they have been destroyed before you, and that you do not inquire about their gods, saying, 'How did these nations serve their gods?--that I also may do the same.' 31 You shall not worship the LORD your God in that way, for every abominable thing that the LORD hates they have done for their gods, for they even burn their sons and their daughters in the fire to their gods. 32 "Everything that I command you, you shall be careful to do. You shall not add to it or take from it.
Do not stray from , Elohim’s instructions for holy living and in how He is to be worshiped.
Mid-2nd cen “church father” Irenaeus held that bishops provided the only safe guide to interpretation of Scripture, thus paving the way for papal primacy. Also, in the interest of unity, doctrinal authority had to be solely established by Episcopal “councils”. “Episcopal” means governed by bishops; so these ideas laid the foundation for Nicolaitanes and a hierarchical chain of command, culminating in the catholic, or “universal” Church.
A quote from Jerome affirms Natsarim existed during the 4th cen CE:
"Recently I read in a certain Hebrew book
that a Hebrew from the Natsarim sect brought to me,
the apocryphon of YirmeYahu, in which I found this text
written word for word." (Jerome; Commentary on Matthew 2:23)
Mat 2: 23 And he went and lived in a city called Nazareth, that what was spoken by the prophets might be fulfilled: "He shall be called a Nazarene."
4th cen church father Epiphanius describes the Natsarim:
“We shall now especially consider heretics who... call themselves Nazarenes; they are mainly Jews and nothing else. They make use not only of the New Testament, but they also use in a way the Old Testament of the Jews; for they do not forbid the books of the Law, the Prophets, and the Writings... so that they are approved of by the Jews, from whom the Nazarenes do not differ in anything, and they profess all the dogmas pertaining to the prescriptions of the Law and to the customs of the Jews, except they believe in Messiah. They preach that there is but one God, and His Son Yeshua the Messiah. But they are very learned in the Hebrew language; for they, like the Jews, read the whole Law, then the Prophets...They differ from the Jews because they believe in Messiah, and from the Christians in that they are to this day bound to the Jewish rites, such as circumcision, the Sabbath, and other ceremonies. They have the Good news according to Matthew in its entirety in Hebrew. For it is clear that they still preserve this, in the Hebrew alphabet, as it was originally written”.
This record shows just how arrogant Christianity had become early on. After Irenaeus, a new error was adopted, “Apostolic Succession”, and the idea that “church” hierarchy could supersede any Commandment, and usurp the title “Israel” for itself. This is called Replacement Theology, and is practiced by almost every Christian church today.
Supersessionism, fulfillment theology, and replacement theology are terms used in biblical interpretation for the belief that the Christian Church supersedes or replaces Israel in God's plan, and that the New Covenant nullifies the biblical promises made to Israel, including the Abrahamic Covenant, the Land Covenant, and the Davidic Covenant. However, it has no Belief in the Mosaic Covenant (), which most Christian groups agree was always intended to be superseded and nullified by the New Covenant.
Evidence the Natsarim Sect existed in opposition to this thinking until the 13th cen CE is found in the writings of Bonacursus, entitled “Against the Heretics”. He refers to “Nazarenes”, also called 'Pasagini':
“Let those who are not yet acquainted with them, please note how perverse their belief and doctrine are. First, they teach that we should obey the Law of Moses according to the letter - the Sabbath, and circumcision, and the legal precepts still being in force. Furthermore, to increase their error, they condemn and reject all the Church Fathers, and the whole Roman Church."
It is possible YHVH preserved a remnant, worshiping “underground” or in secret, however the Messianic, or Natsarim movement did not start in force again until around the 1960’s and 70’s. And it is gaining strength worldwide. My own synagogue is starting at least one, maybe two new synagogues in the Seattle area and another in Brazil within just the last two months!
Sadly, it has not always been so. The Greco-Roman mindset has been failing to understand the foundation of the faith because they approach the Scriptures from a Gentile (non-Covenant) point of view, where Gentiles remain Gentiles after coming to a belief in Yeshua. This is erroneous, since there is but one body, not two. Gentiles must engraft (Rom. 11) into Israel, Israelites do not engraft into a Gentile "church". Besides all this, the word "church" is derived from a Pagan deity, Circe.
The “church fathers” were mostly trained at the Catechetical School of Alexandria, Egypt; founded circa 190 CE. Origen taught there and succeeded Clement as head of the school. Self-castrated and a vegetarian, as were many others of his time and faith, he wasn’t even born until the late 2nd cen CE. Tertulian and Irenaeus were contemporaries.
They developed what later became Christianity, and then Roman “Universalism”, or Catholicism. All were pagans, and many were sun-worshippers who adopted a belief in the Messiah of Yisra’el. They worked predominantly with Greek texts, many writing their own versions (the New Testament is pieced together from over 5000 Greek documents, many if not most of which disagree in some respects to each other, according to Moody Bible Institute). From their own letters, we see they despised the "Natsarim. The church fathers suppressed the Hebrew roots of the faith, developing pagan Greek roots instead.
There were two common traits among all the church fathers: condemnation of the Natsarim, and rabid anti-Semitism. They retained their identity as Gentiles, saying they don’t keep “Jewish” rules. However YHVH gave us laws long before there ever was a Jew. If Adam had no law, he couldn’t have sinned. And YHVH, as Adonai nor as Yeshua never changed any laws. Men did that.
Seminaries today promote teachings of these “church fathers”, men who persecuted and murdered countless Jews and Natsarim. If they have any connection at all to the believers of the 1st cen CE, they are the spiritual descendants of those who hated Rav Sha’ul (Rabbi Paul): “But we desire to hear from you what your views are, for with regard to this sect we know that everywhere it is spoken against." Acts 28:22
The reason Jews and Natsarim, those follow the commands of YHVH, have always been despised is simple. Earth is under the influence of ha satan since Adam & Chavah forfeited YHVH’s sovereignty over Earth. Obeying Commandments, and possessing the witness of Yeshua, are not what the church fathers did; and they weren’t about to allow anyone else to do so. 4th cen church father, Jerome described the Natsarim as “those who accept Messiah in such a way that they do not cease to observe the Old Law.” He did not mean this kindly.
That “Old Law” is ,the commandments of Elohim, guarded by the Natsarim. The dragon of Rev 12 pursues the offspring (Natsarim) of the Woman (Yisra’el) through constant persecutions due to doctrinal competition for control. By their own writings we see that they coexisted with but never were a part of the Natsarim for @ 1400 yrs. The same Natsarim of which Rav Sha’ul was said to be a ringleader.
Yochanan the Immerser said in Luke 3:9 “Even now the axe is laid to the root of the trees. Every tree therefore that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire." The modern Christian church is sprung from a pagan tree, one whose branches do not include or for many not all of, or even any part of the TNK (Old Testament)!
Natsarim are suppressed as heretics and accused of perversion for obeying . The “church fathers”, and now the modern Christian churches interpret the New Testament as they want, then create the appearance of the Old agreeing, often taking quotes out of context; declaring what they can't make agree or parts they don't like “fulfilled”; to them done away with. Everything was and is “New”, and using the phrase “led by the Spirit” they can justify anything! I call this the “Do whatever my sinful li’ll ole’ heart desires” doctrine.
Yirmeyahu (Jer) 17: 9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately sick; who can understand it?
The teachings hatched at the Catechetical School of Alexandria persist in every modern seminary today. The apostasy (falling-away from ) became institutionalized, and men’s traditions were set up to conceal their pagan origins.
Howevr the Ruach HaChodesh, the Spirit of Elohim, does call some into Observance, to worship Adonai as He commanded. Obeying produces love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control; this tree will not be cut down! The lawless tree that is against the Covenant will be. When you are called, onto which tree will you choose to be grafted? |
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