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Post by livn4him on Jun 28, 2014 14:30:53 GMT -8
First, I want to say how blessed I am to have found this site! I want to let you know how great it is to read post without hostility permeating from the screen. I've read your beliefs and rules of "engagement":0) I have desired for so long to walk with like-minded believers, to discuss, with love, the things we are learning from the Word. And to learn from others with a gracious and humble spirit. Thank you for this site!
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Post by Questor on Jun 28, 2014 15:49:42 GMT -8
First, I want to say how blessed I am to have found this site! I want to let you know how great it is to read post without hostility permeating from the screen. I've read your beliefs and rules of "engagement":0) I have desired for so long to walk with like-minded believers, to discuss, with love, the things we are learning from the Word. And to learn from others with a gracious and humble spirit. Thank you for this site! Glad to have you, livn4him! I am glad you are here..we need more voices, and more insight into what others are experiencing in their lives, particularly among the Messianic Gentiles, of which I am one, who are struggling to become Observant in order to please Abba, and yet not knowing how to apply it to our lives as well as we hope to one day.
I hope you will join us often!
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Post by livn4him on Jun 29, 2014 9:57:28 GMT -8
Thank you, Questor. I hope to share more about my walk, or trippings, as soon as possible. And to connect with others to share what the Father has been doing in my life, how I am learning to walk things out (with lots of grace and mercy) and to hear how others are doing in the their pilgrimage... Maybe I can encourage or most likely, be encouraged.☺️
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Post by Questor on Jun 29, 2014 21:02:08 GMT -8
Thank you, Questor. I hope to share more about my walk, or trippings, as soon as possible. And to connect with others to share what the Father has been doing in my life, how I am learning to walk things out (with lots of grace and mercy) and to hear how others are doing in the their pilgrimage... Maybe I can encourage or most likely, be encouraged.☺️ Since I spend most of my time stumbling myself, I look forward to hearing from anyone who has a handle on anything in their life! I continuously mean well, but I find that doesn't get me very far before I have noticed that I have opened my mouth, and begun talking to Abba in the same whiny way I always have.
The only thing I can say is that I have asked for help to notice it, so I can stop talking about me, and start talking with Abba, or praising Him. I have the help, and I do notice it, but if I don't cast out the demon inflicting the ideas on me, I will have no peace, and precious little of that until I spend some time thanking Abba for everything within my view at the time, or can remember, and add in some singing of praises. But I am glad to at least notice I do it.
It's the same thing with keeping Shabbat...there is always something I manage to do that I should not, and just resolve on a better Shabbat for the rest of the day, and to do better next week. And then I thank G-d that I don't still forget it's the Sabbath! You have no idea how many Erev Shabbat sunsets I have missed!
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Post by alon on Jun 29, 2014 21:55:26 GMT -8
First, I want to say how blessed I am to have found this site! I want to let you know how great it is to read post without hostility permeating from the screen. I've read your beliefs and rules of "engagement":0) I have desired for so long to walk with like-minded believers, to discuss, with love, the things we are learning from the Word. And to learn from others with a gracious and humble spirit. Thank you for this site! Welcome aboard live. Good to have you here. There is a lot of good stuff in the archives, though regrettably most of those posters are no longer active. Of those who are active, most of us are searching ourselves. Always good to have another searcher on the journey. Dan C
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Post by R' Y'hoshua Moshe on Jul 6, 2014 19:31:22 GMT -8
Shalom Livin4him,
Welcome to Ahavat Elohim Messianic Discussion Forums! I apologize for the squabbling that took place in your introduction thread (of all places). Our last moderator left without being replaced, and we haven't had anyone that could dedicate themselves to moderating the forum over the last few months. And, although the unfortunate posts that you saw happen under your introduction have been deleted, I am sorry that you had to see that. It was inappropriate, to say the least.
With that being said, I hope that you will give our forum another try.
Blessings to you in Yeshua our Messiah,
R' Reuel
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2014 9:55:12 GMT -8
Welcome to the forum Live. I just came back last night myself. I took a leave of absence for a while. However it is good to be back.
I look forward to sharing encouraging thoughts with you. Many blessings to you.
Moriah Ruth
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Post by livn4him on Jul 11, 2014 18:46:27 GMT -8
Sorry I haven't stop by lately... I appreciate all of your concern for me as a fellow believer... Do you know how much that is needed? My family and I had to make some descisions lately that have us alone again. Question: do you stop fellowshipping with kind, loving people when you disagree on doctrine or stay with them and ignore the bad, keep the good? I ask this because we, as a family, have been alone for some time... We are in a small town with 2 options: United Church of God and Hebrew Roots affiliate of Ralph Messer. The HR is under a Pastor who has been in this walk only 2 years and we are past the basic teachings... We have been blessed with excellent teachings over the few years we've been keeping Sabbath. (We started keeping Sabbath 2007/ March and left Sunday church Feb. 200&) Anyway, any thoughts would be appreciated... Question: Do you receive the Ruach haKadosh only by laying of hands?
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Post by alon on Jul 11, 2014 19:24:05 GMT -8
Sorry I haven't stop by lately... I appreciate all of your concern for me as a fellow believer... Do you know how much that is needed? Absolutely! Part of what we do here is encourage each other, especially those who are alone in one way or another. Sorry you are alone again.It depends on what those doctrinal issues are and how well you can handle discerning errors in doctrine. If the issue is something like the divinity of Yeshua, then I'd say leave the fellowship. If it is things like the "Rapture" then possibly stay. If it is in any way any thing that might cause a problem presenting the salvation message then leave.
I just had to make that very call in leaving a mainstream ministry. The last thing you want to do is be in a position where someone asks you about salvation and you tell them what you believe to be true (which you must do regardless) and have someone else start to argue. Just as bad is to have to tell them "wait while I get someone." Either way you just lost them.
Not knowing much about your situation that's what I'd advise.Honestly, the UCoG is probably your best bet. I say that because there is so much wrong in HR, but it is often difficult to discern the truth there. There will be more wrong in the UCoG, but you'll be much more able to spot the errors, especially if you hang out here as well.
I keep Shabbat, but attend an Assemblies church with my wife on Sundays. I have to bite my tongue a lot, but they all know what I believe and will ask me questions- then watch out! All bets are off if they ask! Conversely there are four other men who try to fly "Messianic" colors here who I refuse to associate with because they deny the deity of Yeshua.That is a tough question, just because I don't know what admin's position is on it. Also I don't know what you mean by it- are you talking about speaking in tongues? I just reread the SoF here and don't think this is addressed, but I will check and get back with you next week on their position.
I can tell you what I believe- the gift of tongues manifests in an intelligible language, i.e. a known language. I also believe we receive the Ruach with salvation.Acts 2:38 Kefa answered them, "Turn from sin, return to God, and each of you be immersed on the authority of Yeshua the Messiah into forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Ruach HaKodesh!
Eph 1:13 Furthermore, you who heard the message of the truth, the Good News offering you deliverance, and put your trust in the Messiah were sealed by him with the promised Ruach HaKodesh, I know there is a lot of controversy surrounding this issue, but it is one of those I would relegate to the "minor" category as I do fellowship with an AoG church.
Hope this all helps.
Dan C Edit- here are the only two places that address this question in the SoF:
*We believe in the present ministry of the Ruach HaKodesh (Holy Spirit) by Whose indwelling the believer is enabled to live a holy life unto God.
*We believe in spiritual gifts given through the Ruach HaKodesh (Holy Spirit) to the individual believer such as prophecy, healing, word of knowledge, and the gift of tongues, ect.
They do not say when the Ruach is given nor does it define tongues. I'm shooting a PM to admin and should have an answer early next week. They may even prefer to just let us all believe what we want. But we'll see.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2014 4:57:23 GMT -8
United Church of God is considered by most Main line Christian group as cultic. Hobart Freeman was also teaching false doctrine. Yes he taught about the Sabbath and the Jewish feats but not in the Jewish mindset. There are also other false teachings that he taught. The United Church of God used to be called Worldwide Church of God. Below is a link. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Church_of_GodAs for the Hebrew Roots, that one is a tough call. However if they do the feasts and the Sabbath according to biblical standards and with a Jewish mindset than this would be Live's best bet. Or she can set up with another MJ group via the internet, where her and her family can listen to teachings as a family. Moriah ruth
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Post by alon on Jul 12, 2014 5:10:02 GMT -8
United Church of God is considered by most Main line Christian group as cultic. Hobart Freeman was also teaching false doctrine. Yes he taught about the Sabbath and the Jewish feats but not in the Jewish mindset. There are also other false teachings that he taught. The United Church of God used to be called Worldwide Church of God. Below is a link. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Church_of_GodAs for the Hebrew Roots, that one is a tough call. However if they do the feasts and the Sabbath according to biblical standards and with a Jewish mindset than this would be Live's best bet. Or she can set up with another MJ group via the internet, where her and her family can listen to teachings as a family. Moriah ruth Knowing that now I'd have to say I agree with Ruth. Just be careful. I came out of HR and the unlearning process was/is both grueling and embarrassing at times.
Dan
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Post by livn4him on Jul 12, 2014 7:14:53 GMT -8
Thank you, Dan and Ruth for your thoughts. Here is our story: I am a homeschooling mother of three. In 2004, while teaching my children the Middle Ages, Reformation, etc. for our history class and as a family reading the Bible through the year, I started asking questions ( I have learned so much as a homeschool mom!). I would go to my Pastor (Sunday church at the time) and ask him questions. Anyway, we had a family at church tell us that Christmas an Easter was wrong so I started searching it out. So by 2006, we stopped celebrating them. By March 2007, we were keeping Sabbath and going to Sunday Church. The Sabbath meeting was at a home and was with Messianic Israel Alliance group. By Feb. 2008 we left Sunday church. This was the hardest thing for me to do because this was my first church family. I don't have the words to talk about all the craziness that happened following the next 4 years. So, I live in a town where people who believe the same but cannot fellowship together. Many were hurt and scared away from anything Hebrew or Messianic minded. So, one dear family attends UCG and one HR. Some have gone back to Sunday church. I am just super cautious. I struggle with my children not growing up with fellowship. It has already been too long. And I don't want to get pulled into another "We are the only way and everyone else is pagan". All I want is to walk right with my precious Savior and share Him with a dying world. I don't want to fight about doctrine ( our family has really been working on correcting those who are in opposition to us gently, in meekness, with patience - 2 Timothy 2:24-25). I love to share Scripture and learn together with others. And I am blessed that my children love the Word, written and Living! Anyway, thank you for being patient with me as I shared this. And thank you for sharing your heart and lives. It encourages me.
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Post by alon on Jul 12, 2014 10:14:12 GMT -8
4 (I'm originally from the South- OK if I abbreviate?) I'm touched by what you wrote of your position. We homeschooled in a small town, and that in itself wasn't easy. To stop those things like holidays and Sunday worship as you found they were wrong is admirable as well. Being the lone holdouts for the truth can't be easy either. Have you looked in neighboring communities for like minded believers?
I took a very quick look at the Messianic Israel Alliance Group website. A lot of what they said seemed OK, but vague. They do however seem to push a Two House theology, which tends to be a quagmire of false teaching. HR too has some good teachings in it, but they almost invariably stray at some point. And the good (at least on the internet) is buried in so much garbage it is difficult to sort out. I started on my own in HR, so I know what a struggle it was just for me. You have to be careful what to teach your children ass well, which makes it double tough. My hat's off to you for hanging in there and trying to raise them in the truth.
This site has a live feed of their Shabbat service (which started about 45 mins. ago; 10:00 AM Pacific time). I'd watch it now, except my computer settings are messed up and it'd be too much like work to sort that out on Shabbat. Theirs is a more traditional Jewish type service, and usually goes over three hours. But it is a very beautiful service. You might want to give it a try. www.synagoguechm.com/livestreaming.html
I'd encourage you to keep looking in neighboring communities because you never know. I looked for well over a year (almost two) and couldn't find anything. About the time I quit looking, a rabbi started coming into a community not too far away and teaching on Wed. nights. It put my wife's' nose out of joint when I found them over a year later and started going there instead of to the AoG Wednesday service. She still won't even talk about anything I do or learn there. I consider myself very fortunate, as the Rabbi is very knowledgeable and teaches the truth always.
I know I've thrown out tons of books that looked good in the synopsis but when I got them they contained false teachings. As a homeschool mom I doubt you can afford that. It may be a longshot, but you can ask about books here before you buy, and maybe one of us has read it and could answer questions. We might know of resources that would help as well.
We too love sharing scripture. We're all good Jews in training though- you'll get more than a few opinions. I myself have at least three opinions on any given topic!
Seriously though, post a topic and you'll probably get some food for thought if nothing else! And I think everyone here does strive for the truth, even if we sometimes see it differently.
But hang in there. I know it is tough finding sheep amongst so many goats. Even tougher when those around you fall away or fall into apostasy so quickly. I've had this happen here so many times, and I am the only true Messianic in my town. I'm working on a couple of people though. But regardless if I convince anyone else or not, I simply cannot go back to a lie now I've found the truth. It's a huge strain on my marriage, but I have to follow where God has shown me the truth.
My prayers are with you, and if I can help just ask.
Dan C
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Post by livn4him on Jul 12, 2014 10:29:19 GMT -8
Blessings and Thank you, Dan. I am checking out their live stream right now.
In Messiah, Dawn
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